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How long to potty train?
  • Our Kira is now 1 yr, and she's been with us since she was 3 months. We take her potty outside and she also has an "indoor" potty pen when the weather is not cooperating. Problem is, she seems to prefer to only do #2 in her indoor potty pen. She will go outside and pee without any problems, but getting her to do #2 is a chore. Additionally, we crate her during the day when we are at work, and she will almost always pee in her crate...rarely #2, but it happens now and then. We keep her on a schedule and its almost as if we take her out every 2 hours because she doesn't seem to be able to hold it, otherwise she will make an accident in the house. How long should potty training typically take? I thought shibas were easy to potty train, so I am at a lost. We have a 1.5 year old akita, and she does just fine with pottying only outside. Thanks.
    Post edited by notoriousscrat at 2012-12-12 15:45:28
  • INU RYUUINU RYUU
    Posts: 1507
    Well, it seems that she is trained #1 outside and #2 inside. Inu and Penny have certain spots outside they prefer for #2. Its almost automatic when they get to those spots. Is your indoor potty pen available all the time or just when the weather is bad? By potty pen do you mean pads? I would be tempted to move the potty pen outside to a certain spot where she has done #2 (if feasable) or at least get her to use the pen outside and then take her to the spot without the pen being there. My guys are pad trained in case of bad weather, etc. No pad down means you got to hold it till we go out.
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  • CrimsonO2CrimsonO2
    Posts: 1165
    I'm sorry but it sounds like your dog just lost her sense of boundaries. If she feels comfortable peeing while she's in her crate, then she isn't housebroken. If you think she's having trouble "holding it" you might want to go take her to the vet to see if she has a bladder infection. My Shikoku puppy had that because she kept needing to pee constantly and when she does, I'm told it's painful.

    Shibas are considered easy to train regarding potty training because they are very cat-like and try to keep themselves (and their area clean). Whether it be their sleeping area or their play area, they tend to not want to go to the bathroom in places they normally frequent. It is not uncommon for your dog to #1 and #2 in or around the same area every time.

    So, that being said, if your dog is used to peeing in her crate, she will continue to pee in her crate. The same can be said for pooping on her indoor potty. If you want to break this habit, then I suggest bringing treats on your walk and treating your dog for when she goes to the bathroom outside (#1 and #2). You are on the right track in keeping to routines but the boundaries need to be set.

    I would take Nature's Miracle and wipe down the inside of her crate to make sure she has no urge or inclination to relieve herself in the place that she considers her bed.

    What's your definition of uncooperative weather? My Shiba hates the rain but he'll still run out to his usual poop spot and quickly eliminate before dragging me back inside.

    Jesse
  • sunyatasunyata
    Posts: 8507
    I agree with the above... Your Shiba has been trained to use the bathroom inside. So stop allowing that to happen. Take up the indoor potty area. Just so you know, Shibas are weather proof. They may not like going out in the rain, snow, heat, etc., but I promise, a short potty break will not kill them. :)

    As for the crate, clean it VERY well. And get a smaller crate and/or divider so that there is just enough room for your Shiba to lay down comfortably. Take up anything that is absorbent in the crate. Doing this will hopefully help prevent her from using the bathroom in the crate.

    And like Jesse said, take her to the vet. There very well could be a medical problem for her peeing in the crate. Also, how long is she crated while you are at work? Perhaps it is too long and she may need a break. Could you come home for lunch or hire a dog walker?
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  • Hi there...sorry it took me 2 days to reply back. Just been extremely busy.
    So, to help answer some of the questions above:
    -when the weather is bad (i.e. heavy raining), we use the puppy pads in her indoor pen to allow her to relieve herself
    -the indoor pen is separate from her crate
    -the vet checked her out, and she does not have any apparent health issues
    -we tried the treats method when we go outside, but she is often so distracted by things around her, she doesn't take the treats. Once she does her business outside, she immediately wants to run back into the house.
    -we do have a dog walker that takes her out around lunch time, and when we ask her how Kira was when she came by, she always tells us Kira is fine and no mess in the crate...so my guess is that she is making a mess later in the afternoon.
    Good news is that the last couple of days Kira hasn't made a mess in her crate. We're hoping it was a "phase" or something, and I totally agree she isn't fully housebroken. I kinda like the idea of taking away the absorbent material in her crate, but I'm so afraid that if she pees it will get all over her. I guess that's going to be part of her training process? Thanks again for all the great ideas, and I'll provide an update on her progress.
  • Question, is the crate small enough that she is forced to lay in her pee when she goes? I've heard this can desensitize some dogs to their natural instinct to not use the bathroom where they live so if it is that small, that might be part of your problem.http://obeytheshiba.blogspot.com/
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  • Her crate is small enough that she can stand and turn around in it, and lay down comfortably. I was worried at first that this was too small, but the vet told us that was the proper size for a crate for our shiba. I've read the same guidelines from other sources as well. I am really hoping she is not desensitized from her natural instinct to not use the bathroom where she sleeps. If she is, I don't know what I would be able to do...
  • I believe I saw something about fixing that kind of desensitization in a book called "Training the Hard to Train Dog" so I suppose that might be a place to start. Either way, I think a good book with positive training methods for house-breaking from the library or the book store might be a good idea. It's certainly where I would start to look in your situation. If I didn't find anything or if the book(s) weren't helpful I would probably try a professional trainer or behavioralist next.http://obeytheshiba.blogspot.com/
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  • bhamubhamu
    Posts: 16
    I know this is an old thread but don't want to start another one to annoy Sunyata :). Our girl Mochi is going to be 12weeks in two days. We got her a week back and so far housebreaking seems to be going well, at least I think so. She generally pee's around the same place in our yard and I do the treats and praise her. She also defecates outside but not at one place. She walks around for a while and does it different places in the yard. Sometimes she does it twice in two different places in 10-15 min apart. Is that normal or should I just praise her only if she does at one consistent place? She only had 2 accidents so far and both I think are my mistake. The first time was when she got excited a lot and second time after she woke up from a nap and I missed her for 2 seconds and then she found a place on carpet. Typically what signs tell me that she is housebroken completely? At what age they usually are able to tell when she wants to go out to pee?
  • MontbloncMontblonc
    Posts: 12
    My shiba poops twice on her morning walk with some time in between, I guess it takes time to get the bowels moving again.

    Do you prefer Mochi to go in just one spot? I praised my shiba whenever she pooped and peed outside, just to reinforce the training.

    As long as you manage a potty schedule, notice her signals and provide the opportunities to go out at the right times, you should be fine. My shiba was 6 months when she started telling me she needed to go out by pacing near the exit doors or stress panting after some play (learned that the hard way). You could teach Mochi to ring a bell if it helps with the communication.

    When I noticed my pup could hold it in after something super exciting happened, I was relieved we were making some good headway on the potty training.
  • Our Tanaka was 13 weeks when we got him, and was going to the bottom of the steps and whining to go out within just a couple of days.
    We've had him a month now and still no accidents inside. He'll increase his whine to a yodel and come to get my hand if I don't get up fast enough.
    It helps that we're retired so always home with him. Another big help I think was that the 1st week and 1/2 I gave him a treat every time he went and then gradually backed off to giving him treats intermittently when he goes. I still give him a treat once in a while to keep reinforcing his behavior, and I always praise him for going whether I have a treat with me or not.
    It can be challenging for him to stay focused every time we go out, because we have a lot of other dogs here at the park. It's rare that someone else isn't out with their dog at the same time I have him out. Daytime he does ok, but it bothers him at night sometimes when it's really dark out, and he can't see the other dog clearly. Sometimes i have to just take him in and then take him back out when he gets fussy again.
  • bhamubhamu
    Posts: 16
    For the pee, I was hoping she can do at one place so I can remove the snow at that place during winter. Otherwise, I am happy as long as she does that inside home. In the last two weeks, we had 3 accidents mostly my mistakes. The first time she had dinner and she peed right after that on the carpet. The second time when she woke up from a nap and went to a different carpet and peed. The third time it was right after I played with her. I am trying to be vigilant and taking her more often than necessary now to avoid an accident. She seems to be able to hold it through the night (10.15 to 6 am) (knock wood :)). She seems to prefer to pee on the rugs (we have hardwood with just area rugs) so I am thinking of taking out all the rugs out for some time until she gets fully potty trained. Will she be back to doing on rugs when I put them back (I am cleaning thoroughly)? Any tips on how to train her to ring the bell?
  • LilikoiLilikoi
    Posts: 1150
    I did remove a couple of things like big cushions that Ozzy preferred to pee on when he was young hahah. He never peed on them once I brought them back, after he was no longer having potty accidents. Though I still watched him carefully to make sure they didn’t seem like attractive potty spots even once he was fully potty trained haha. Sometimes changes can just cause a small set back, so it’s good to always be on the look out when something is new or has changed, like if you have guests over or get a new piece of furniture, etc.

    I taught Ozzy to ring a bell fairly easily. First I taught him to “touch” things. I used a clicker and gave him a treat every time he touched it, even when he would just sniff it. I would award big once he used his paw, and incorporated the command “touch.” Every time we go outside, I ask him to “touch.” He is very good about ringing the bell when he needs to go out. He made the connection to ring the bell before going outside very quickly with treats and praise. :)

    Lol, I also got him in winter, and he used to only pee on snow hahah. I had to walk him to the back of our apartment yard where the snow was in the shade and hadn’t melted in the spring. :))
  • ZenkiZenki
    Posts: 381
    hmm... in the beginning, i was super obsessive with sticking to a potty schedule and trying to encourage Zenki to potty in the same spots/areas. I would stay outside in the middle of winter waiting for him to go. we would stay outside as long as i could take until he potties. It got very frustrating. Then my breeder gave a nugget of wisdom and i stopped stressing too much about it. She said "He will go when he needs to go." I still tried to stick to a schedule, if he goes great. if not, its also ok. but i stopped staying outside longer than 30-45mins. i did go out more but with fixed duration. I think this set the tone with Zenki that his 'outside' time is not unlimited so he needs to go as soon as his paws hit grass.

    In total, Zenki had 3 pee accidents and 0 poop accidents inside the house. Also, He peed in the middle of my bed which according to my breeder was NO ACCIDENT (thank God for waterproof matress liners =)) ). That one he did on purpose. I slowly increased the time i made him hold his potty but stuck with the (Age in Months + 1) rule for the number of hours i am making him hold it. at the same time, i slowly increased the area in the house that he has access to. once i could trust him for the entire workday and 90% of the floor area of my house then i considered him potty trained. :D

    like with @lilikoi, you might have to remove his favorite pee spots inside the house. There might be residual scents that he can still smell on your rug that tells him "this is a safe-pee spot".

    As far as bell training goes, i trained him how to "shake a paw" and "high five" first. Then i introduced the bell so he can "high five" the bells. =))
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    Post edited by Zenki at 2018-01-30 19:56:33
  • AnjyilAnjyil
    Posts: 744
    We generally used the crate training method--he was in the crate whenever we couldn't watch him, and in his pen area for the majority of the time. Either my husband or I took him out every couple of hours. The only times he ever had an accident were 100% our fault because we goofed on reading his signals. He gives very very clear signals, but we always assumed he was just being noisy to get attention. Now we know better.

    Now a year and four months, and he does a really good job of not peeing inside. The only issues we had were: dog hotels (other dogs peed there so he felt he could, too) and the two times my husband didn't make sure he had pottied while on a walk. To be fair, hubby has been super tired lately. Lots of bugs going around, and he refuses medicine and checking his temp XD Silly man.

    In the case of accidents, we have been fairly consistent. We get him out of the way (either one of us takes him outside or he goes in his crate) clean up the mess without looking at him or making any kind of fuss, scrub it down, bring him back in/let him out and play with him in the freshly cleaned area, or do training, etc.

    Generally speaking, Coal does NOT want to go inside. As long as we watch him and take him out prior to something new (dog hotel, etc) he is fine.

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