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Klee Kai vs. Shiba Inu
  • INU RYUUINU RYUU
    Posts: 1507
  • anyone who buys a designer dog loses a few points in my book. if you want a designer dog you go to the pound and rescue one. they have all kinds and you can make up your own name. a designer dog is a good ole lovable mutt with a fancy name and a big price tag.

    most of the description is pretty good except the agression part. i think that shibas agression is way overblown, and a lot of it can be attributed to their play style.
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3664
  • As I recall from reading some of the Klee Kai development info, the developer of this breed wanted a cute, small version of a husky that would be very sweet in terms of temperament. Her description of the Klee Kai was almost dreamlike; she had her "vision" of what a Klee Kai should be. She was not looking for an independent, strong-willed dog.

    That said, I know of at least one older Klee Kai who was saved through the efforts of the Northern CA Shiba Rescue and sent to a Klee Kai rescuer/breeder. Have seen a Klee Kai at the dog park and he was a nice little guy.
  • INU RYUUINU RYUU
    Posts: 1507
    Post edited by INU RYUU at 2010-11-11 01:42:15
  • Post edited by shibamistress at 2010-11-11 04:03:10
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 6678
    I've never seen a klee kai up close or owned one so can't comment on their temperament, but I didn't like this breeder comment about the shiba yes they can be dog aggressive, but sometimes it's due to lack of socialization, bad breeders, or something bad happened in the shiba's life...

    They look cute and stuff, but I'd rather own a husky or a shiba inu..
  • ljowen123ljowen123
    Posts: 3105
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 6678
    I felt the same way when I met Saya I think shiba inu are a perfect breed for me wouldn't mind having rescued shiba inu all in my life and maybe a kai ken here and there.. lol
  • InoushiInoushi
    Posts: 555
    Why are people so against new breeds being developed? I don't think every new breed should just blanketely be labeled a designer dog. Most of the breeds we have today were created in the same fashion. Nor do I think all downsizing is really horrible (I for one think some breeds who have painfully short lives should be downsized), I don't hear people boycotting Pomeranians when their original size was 40 + pounds. While I don't believe in their creation for looks, I do believe in their creation for working purposes. Creating better bomb sniffing dogs or service dogs, in my opinion is a great idea. Just as its a great idea to breed dogs that better fit into our current environment instead of preserving breeds that have highly strict requirements in order to properly fit into today's world. I want to stress that "hybrid" dogs don't fit into what I'm saying here, but if a person has enough individuals to breed dogs that predictably come out the way any established breed would, and if they put the huge amount of time and effort into doing this, I don't think they should be scorned.
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 6678
    I agree with ya Ariel I don't have too many issues with this, but when people are making designer dogs for profit not to improve on or make a new breed then I disagree with doing that..

    I believe some people are making an improvement on English bull dog the new breed is old English bull dog are much more healthier can breath better etc..

    http://www.bulldoginformation.com/Olde-English-Bulldogge.html

    Main issue on this thread is that the breeder commented on the shiba like it's some aggressive mean dog.. >.<

    There's a list online somewhere with a list of a lot of designer breeds and it's crazy the combination some people are making..

    If your making a breed or trying to improve fine, but lot of designer breeders are doing it for the money and are not concerned if the poodle and retriever are of good health..

    The breeding down are size that's fine and dandy, but the who teacup chihuahua or teacup Yorkie is crazy my mom's friend has a teacup chihuahua that dog is so tiny I was afraid of even petting it..
  • sunyatasunyata
    Posts: 8589
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 6678
    I agree with that Casey I hate seeing shiba mixes breed on purpose one local breeder selling shiba/husky mixes on purpose calling them mini huskies..

    Or someone breeding a shiba with a chihuahua or pom to make a smaller shiba.. >.<

    If I get a shiba mix it'd be from a rescue not a breeder..
  • ljowen123ljowen123
    Posts: 3105
  • I met a Klee Kai once and the owners freaked out when Yoshi went to play with him because Yoshi is waaaay too rough and aggressive and a maniac and might break their precious dog in half. Seemed to me that the little Klee Kai could've handled a little Shiba wrestling but whatever.
  • RorsRors
    Posts: 165
    I see a difference between new breeds and designer breeds. In Australia in the last few years a certain shopping centre / mall pet store franchise has expanded and encouraged the whats that puppy in the window concept, I dont know the source of these dogs but have heard disgusting stories on how these dogs are bred and treated if not sold within a determined time frame.
    I see these and the backyarder sold versions of randomly breed animals as Designer dogs - purely for profit.

    New breeds however have to come from some where. If Klee Kai are a new breed then they will have a consistent standard that breeds true.

    Look at Shibas exsisting for thousands of years but they weren't establish as a NIPPO standard until 1936, they were a breed that had regional traits. Its size and shape specifically selected for the mountainous regions they came from - these selections took into account the need for an agile independent dog that could survive the wild. (Source paraphrased "The Total Shiba" by Gretchen Haskett and Susan Houser)
    BTW is anyone using them to hunt?? Apartments and cages are their natural environment?

    Please understand I mean no offense to those that dont hunt or have apartments BUT look after their charges with love and respect.

    Any dog attribute selected as a focus to be a integral part of that breed is a man made design Purpose is relative. To labour the point: if it is not a wolf it is a designer dog.

    Look at horticulture should we only ever grow what can be eaten?

    I believe what reflects in a good breed is the ethic and respect for the life (including plants no GM!) that is being created.
    PS the breeder is out of line.
    Post edited by Rors at 2010-11-12 19:47:50
  • InoushiInoushi
    Posts: 555
    Yeah the comment didn't make any sense to me, especially the part about prey drive, if I remember correctly they used Siberians in this breed and I know for a fact their prey drive is just as big as a shiba's. The whole aggression towards other dogs doesn't really offend me much. Untrained I can easily see how a Shiba may behave that way, especially towards little dogs. I personally rather see negative comments like that, so that people can get an idea of how intensively socialization needs to occur. All too often I run into people who only ask me two things when they see Kenshin "What is he?" and, "How much does he cost.". I take the time to tell them how much work he is, but I always worry about the people who I talk to and just seem to be lost in his cuteness factor....
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3664
    Post edited by Calia at 2010-11-12 20:52:13
  • Kuro_KaiKuro_Kai
    Posts: 543
    I haven't noticed any aggression in the Shibas I've met.

    Not going to touch the designer breed debate. It'll turn into an argument
  • BradA1878BradA1878
    Posts: 2242
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 6678
    Hhmm Interesting! =)

    Saya seems to be only leash reactive takes a few times meeting a dog on leash to feel OK, but off leash she is wonderful with dogs. She never seems to try to hurt other dogs when she is on leash she just snaps and growls trying to tell them to back off.
  • BradA1878BradA1878
    Posts: 2242
    Post edited by BradA1878 at 2010-11-14 15:03:47
  • JudyJudy
    Posts: 183
    Frodo is reactive to other dogs and would try to hurt them. I feel we were very fortunate to be able to add Chelsie to our home, but it took 6 months of walking them together, but far enough apart to not elicit a reaction from Frodo. Over time we were able to walk them closer together and it progressed from there. He would play with her while on leash, but only outside. Inside he would still go after her. After about 5 months, he would play with her on leash inside and finally, inside off leash. I think Chelsie was determined to stay with us and she was submissive to him while not to some other dogs. Frodo remains reactive to any other dog while Chelsie is ok with other dogs as long as they do not show aggression to her. The main problem we have between them is they have to be fed in separate areas and treats need to be something that can be eaten quickly.
  • INU RYUUINU RYUU
    Posts: 1507
  • glenglen
    Posts: 5
    When I hear people criticize todays designer breeds, I would remind them that many of the breeds that exist today once were designer breeds. Three examples:
    1.German Shepherd: developed by Capt. Stephanitz and others from a "wolf-like" dog and various farm and herding dogs (no one is certain which breeds), to produce a dog that could both herd and guard livestock.
    2.Doberman: Developed by Louis Doberman, a tax collector, to protect him on his rounds, bred from German Shepherd, German Pinscher, Manchester Terrier, Greyhound, and Weimaraner stock.
    3.Rhodesian Ridgeback: Developed by European settlers in Rhodesia to hunt and guard in temperature extremes, bred from (it is thought) Mastiff, Great Dane, Bloodhound, a Pointer Breed, Greyhound, and a native dog of the Hottentot tribe (which had a ridge of hair down the middle of its back).
  • zobie02zobie02
    Posts: 89
    I was originally going to get a Alaskan klee kai until I decided on a Shiba Inu. Both are very beautiful dogs.
  • tatonkatatonka
    Posts: 1210
  • BootzBootz
    Posts: 3495
    Actually met a nice AKK at the dog part this past Saturday. It had a nice temperament and same play style as Bootz. Although I was insulted when the people thought the AKK was a black shiba...I told them black Shibas don't have coloring like that and they brushed me off x.x and resume saying its a shiba too.....
    Post edited by Bootz at 2012-10-23 00:57:07
  • RyanRyan
    Posts: 293

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