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Puppy Mills: What they are, ways to work against them
  • Didn't know where else to put this, but ShibaScout rescue is going to get some dogs from an auction and could use donations. I know not everyone agrees with buying dogs from auctions and that's fine, but for those who do, consider donating if you can:

    http://www.shibascoutrescue.com/

    scroll down the page to find the information on the auction. I believe it is this weekend.
  • curlytailscurlytails
    Posts: 2779
    On the subject of effectively working against puppy mills --

    I heard recently about Senate Bill 130 in Ohio moving through the House and Senate...
    http://www.legislature.state.oh.us/bills.cfm?ID=129_SB_130
    http://www.animallawcoalition.com/companion-animal-breeding/article/1355
    http://www.columbusdogconnection.com/PuppyMillBill3.htm

    Have any Ohioans heard about this? I have not looked thoroughly into this, so I don't know how effective, useful, or fair it is as a piece of legislation. Supposedly a lot of the major auction venues in Ohio had already shut down in anticipation of this bill passing, which is part of why auctions are shifting primarily to nearby states like Missouri and Kansas, etc. This is also why competition and prices have been skyrocketing... which is also working against rescues.

    It's something to add to the overall picture.
    image
    Bowdu 寶肚 (Shiba) and Bowpi 寶媲 (Basenji) with M.C.
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    I've found this site to be very informative:

    http://www.nopuppymillscanada.ca/canadian_laws.htm

    It's probably more useful to those in Canada but is relevant to all concerned with this topic.

    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • knnwangknnwang
    Posts: 645
    ROFL. brilliant :D
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Another good article on mills, orginally posted in the auction thread. It's long, but very informative. One thing that really struck me as important is how they noted that NO mill puppy is going to be temperamentally sound, and all are going suffer from problems due to lack of socialization, lack of experience (some never get out of cages) or positive interactions with humans.

    http://www.milwaukeemag.com/article/242011-PuppyHell
  • curlytailscurlytails
    Posts: 2779
    Adding another article:
    "Humane Society: Missouri has 24 of the 100 worst puppy mills"
    http://www.ksdk.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=380643

    Granted, the HSUS is highly controversial about their policies, and their agendas have been known to overstep their bounds. I do not, however, dispute the names on this particular list, though I would encourage folks to dig deeper as to why they're there in the first place.

    The HSUS list of 100 "worst" puppy mills is excerpted here:
    http://www.ksdk.com/assetpool/documents/130515044436_100WorstPuppyMills.pdf

    From a longer, 45-page report:
    http://www.humanesociety.org/assets/pdfs/pets/puppy_mills/100-puppy-mills-report.pdf#Top
    (cases involving Shibas specifically mentioned three times)

    And there are definitely names on that list that I have seen at auction and in puppy mill Shiba pedigrees.
    image
    Bowdu 寶肚 (Shiba) and Bowpi 寶媲 (Basenji) with M.C.
    Post edited by curlytails at 2013-05-15 23:30:39
  • curlytailscurlytails
    Posts: 2779
    Sorry, one last comment, after having read that article in the Milwaukee Mag reposted by shibamistress above...

    I would quibble with this point in their reporting:

    "Ironically, most of the auctioned dogs are actually bought by humane societies and rescue groups looking to save poorly bred puppies and mother dogs that have bred litters until exhaustion."

    Maybe that was true for the Thorp auction -- I'm not sure. The Thorp Auctions, BTW, are no longer in the business of buying and selling dogs (cf. http://www.nowisconsinpuppymills.com/thorp-auction-alert.html). Anyway, I am pretty sure that the minority of dogs are sold to rescuers at the Missouri auctions. It is considered a "good" day when 20% make it out of the breeder system and into rescue. And those who attend know full well how controversial the practice is...
    image
    Bowdu 寶肚 (Shiba) and Bowpi 寶媲 (Basenji) with M.C.
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Yeah, I totally disagree with that statement, Curlytails! Good catch on your part--I was skimming the article and missed it.

    here's another one that states the obvious on mills, but is worth reading since it is a quick read: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/canine-corner/201305/behavior-differences-in-dogs-pet-stores-versus-breeders

    It notes what was said above, that most all dogs from mills are going to have problems, either health problems and/or temperament problems from their early environment.
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    I believe she was talking about one particular auction, where two thirds of the dogs were bought by rescue groups, in what sounds like was a organized 'intervention'.

    I'm glad the Thorpe Auctions are no longer in the dog business. I hope articles like this helped to play a role in it.

    I realize the article is a bit dated, and yes, long, but I still think its a good read. It gives some really in depth information on what mills/auctions are really like, as well as shines a light on just how despicable these people really are.
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    I agree Kobe1468. Good article, and I'm glad you linked it!
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    Well here's another one. Canada is definatly not immune to this problem. I will try to find some new info on the regulation changes mentioned in this article.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/story/2011/09/17/quebec-puppy-mill-raid.html


    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    This is the best I could come up with, for now. Find it astonishing that there is still no jail time for these offenders!
    I took a quick look at the actual act, and to date, most of these new regulations are still not being enforced.

    http://www.hsi.org/world/canada/news/releases/2012/06/amended_quebec_animal_health_act_062812.html


    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Another mill is being shut down:


    http://www.upnorthlive.com/news/story.aspx?id=901547#.UZ-TM8u9KSP


    See more info in the how to spot a puppy mill thread
    Post edited by shibamistress at 2013-05-24 17:39:49
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    A link for my fellow Shiba owners in Ontario, Canada. Please 'like'.

    https://m.facebook.com/PeopleAgainstPuppyMillsOntario?id=399004790147025&_rdr

    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    Sorry but just love this...and is so true. Every little bit helps!

    Photobucket Pictures, Images and Photos
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    I'm so happy that these dogs are getting a second chance at a good life! Praise to the shelters/rescues for accepting these dogs so readily, and to the ASPCA for yet another job well done!
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    I apologize if this has already been posted in another thread. It's a very detailed and extremely heartbreaking article. It is LONG( five pages), but if you have the time, it's worth reading.

    http://m.humanesociety.org/news/magazines/2013/05-06/anatomy-of-a-puppy-mill-raid.html


    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    So I have been so darn negative recently concerning mills. Can't really help it, but thought I'd put on a sad but sweet story for a change!

    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10151606840494731&id=156905404730&_rdr


    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 6678
    Very sweet also sad video. Love the video of the chihuahua rolling in the grass.
    Photobucket
    Nicole, 5year old Bella(Boxer), and 4year old Saya(Shiba inu)
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Good article on the mills. It is important to know what they are, and though long, it told the story. As they said in the article, the puppies are only their 7 or 8 weeks, but what are the parents going through? That's just another reason to avoid mills.
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    Thought this might be helpful to anyone who might not know what the difference is between a mill and a BYB.

    I think maybe we put more emphasis on mills, just because of how horribly inhumane they really are. But these BYB's, while typically not as inhumane, are putting out puppies at an alarming rate.
    Fine, some may have 'good' intentions, but ignorance is no excuse!

    http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?A=1448


    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Thanks, great link! But damn, 70% of dogs AKC dogs are from bybs? Yikes!
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Sorry for the double post, but this was posted on the NK side. It's horrible (so trigger warnings: animals are in horrific conditions). This is a mill in Japan. This is one of the reasons we've warned people to be very cautious indeed about importing dogs, because you don't want to be supporting this kind of horror. Of course, unfortunately, this kind of thing happens all the time: in Japan, in the US, probably elsewhere.

    link: http://arkbark.net/?q=en/node/4207

    video:



    Also, check out this link: which was on the same page. There are still earthquake dogs available for adoption: http://arkbark.net/?q=en/node/7
    Post edited by shibamistress at 2013-06-14 19:18:58
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    Thx for sharing. I'm sort of beyond words!

    Will let the video speak for itself...


    Edit: to add a link I just found...some good info on it!

    http://www.paw-rescue.org/PAW/PETTIPS/DogTip_breedersandpetshops.php

    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
    Post edited by Kobe1468 at 2013-06-14 19:55:08
  • lindsaytlindsayt
    Posts: 4786
    I recall several people here over time, asking "why not buy a Shiba from Japan instead of from a US breeder; at least you won't be supporting puppy mills and you will be improving genetic diversity in the US", and saying some of us were lying, making stuff like this up, discriminating against the culture of Japan, etc. Well, there's a reason I don't recommend casual pet owners buy from Japan instead of waiting for a reputable US breeder for their pet (if they live here), and this is one of the big reasons why. The other big reason is that most pet owners have no idea about breeding quality and what is needed in the US, and get easily suckered into believing that what they are offered would be valuable to breeders here, or is somehow "exclusive". Guess again.
    "Common sense isn't so common"
    photo c5d87957-61b6-48af-a440-4187cbfc861b_zps88ccdf88.jpg
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Exactly what I thought, Lindsay, which is why I reposted it here.
  • KikkiKikki
    Posts: 73
    Watching that video brought tears to my eyes. I'm so beyond furious about what goes around everywhere in the world. Not just puppy mills but also countries and cultures where dogs are worth nothing. In Vietnam where it's very common to have a dog leashed all it's life to "guard" or keep intrudes away. My mother visited some of your distant relatives out in the countryside last year and she told me how they chain half a dozen dogs throughout their property so no intruders would come and steal their chickens and such. Without shelter and beaming hot sun all day and no access to water!!! Tied up with hard metal wire around their necks semi-choking them. My mother that's been a dog lover since childhood felt so sorry for them and did some basic changes make them more comfortable. Washed and cleaned some old buckets laying that she could use as a water bowl for them and looks for cardboard and anything she could to make some shade for them to lay under. She also tried to educate those relatives to at least provide the dogs with water or they'd die because of dehydration (but to deaf ears ofcourse). I think about those dogs quite often and wonder how they are doing now when my mother isn't there to care for them.
    photo 09add2ab-be4c-4b53-98a7-1a6bc4311b43_zps71ebc933.jpg
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587





    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    So I find this new database to be very interesting, and think it could be useful. I searched for Shiba breeders, and there were five on the database.

    http://blog.aspca.org/content/picture-worth-1000-words-aspca-launches-photo-database-usda-licensed-dog-breeders

    I got a good kick at the comments section below the article...didn't take them long to get off track!
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Just saw this article on the HSUS's campaign against USDA licensed breeders, and it mentions someone who got her Shiba from a mill (and has clearly learned why that was a bad idea!)

    Good!

    http://news.yahoo.com/aspca-uses-usda-photos-fight-183839521.html
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    So glad they convicted this lady! Nowhere near enough, IMO, but she's shut down.
    I really love how these idiots always say "but I love them...they are like family"!! Yeah, maybe some mental issues going on.

    Anyhow, be careful Alberta...sounds like she's taken up new residence!

    http://www.leaderpost.com/touch/news/regina/Sask+puppy+mill+owner+fined/8619519/story.html?rel=815153

    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Wow, glad they got her. I hope she doesn't start up a new (illegal) business.
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    I hate how easy it is to find this stuff! I wasn't going to post this, but I think the OP is looking to get this story spread. Don't blame them!
    Yet another heartbreaking story of why to avoid pet stores...aka puppy mills!


    https://m.facebook.com/#!/story.php?story_fbid=597515670270737&id=185412231481085&__user=100000839243481


    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    It's true, these stories are too common. And heartbreaking! And though I wish everyone knew enough to avoid pet stores and not support mills, people don't and these businesses thrive on ignorance, and they don't care about the dogs, or the people who spend a fortune trying to save them, and whose hearts break trying to treat an ill dog.

    And the problems from the dog being too small are also why I loathe the jerks who purposely breed mame shibas.

    :(
  • Occasionally there are people defending mills and pet stores so unfortunately, there will likely always be a demand for these irresponsibly bred dogs. Sometimes it's ignorance, but sometimes it's impatience, or the desire not to have to bother with a screening or have an onerous legal burden (as one person described the terms of contract with my wonderful breeder).

    But I have hope that the majority of people do care enough to not want to support an industry based on the exploitation of animals. One hopes that ethics will win the day over convenience (especially when it's just the illusion of convenience, given the health issues for many of these dogs). All we can try to do is spread the word as much as possible. While I cannot stand PETA, I do think this is one area where increased legislation helps. I just wish it were a different group spearheading the message.

    Unfortunately, keeping up with puppy millers is akin to the battle between financial regulators and those who are the innovators of financial products. As regulations increase, the other party will come up with new ways to work around the restrictions and take advantage of loopholes or poorly worded legislation.

    Check out this little "magazine" for puppy millers, posing as a concerned animal welfare/rights group.

    http://www.kennelspotlight.com/
  • curlytailscurlytails
    Posts: 2779
    @violet_in_seville I get some sick kicks out of reading the Kennel Spotlight. A disturbing window into the minds of pet breeding "professionals." It's an interesting publication to me because it does humanize the puppy millers in a way, at the same time that their words completely devalue the lives of these dogs -- or rather, their livestock. It's a difference in values between me and them, and a reminder of some of the basic divides that exist in this country...

    Also, @Kobe1468, I can't access the Facebook link you posted, I think because you posted a link for mobile readers...?
    image
    Bowdu 寶肚 (Shiba) and Bowpi 寶媲 (Basenji) with M.C.
    Post edited by curlytails at 2013-07-10 12:26:55
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    That's odd....I read the post on my laptop, not mobile....

    anyway, look at this from the kennel spotlight page. Their position on "puppy mills" which is basically a semantic argument to separate themselves from the term. I disagree--I haven't seen any large scale commercial breeder I would feel is NOT a problem, but here's there take:

    http://www.kennelspotlight.com/22102_swPub_juneSpotlight_FINAL_PROOF_pg_12-13.pdf
  • Yeah, they and I have a very different idea about what it is to treat an animal "inhumanely."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    @curlytails...you are correct, I do everything via iPhone, don't own a home computer, if you can believe that.

    I got the story off 'The Puppy Mill Project's Facebook page.
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3664
    Check this out, a list of instructional PDFs about what is required to be a "good" commercial dog breeder: http://www.cfsph.iastate.edu/Education-Training/introductory-course-for-commercial-dog-breeders.php
    image
  • lindsaytlindsayt
    Posts: 4786
    Pretty appalling photos...they look like animals kept in the worst zoos
    "Common sense isn't so common"
    photo c5d87957-61b6-48af-a440-4187cbfc861b_zps88ccdf88.jpg
  • curlytailscurlytails
    Posts: 2779
    @Calia Thanks, that was super interesting!
    And it's very distressing how often Shibas show up in their example photos -- acknowledging just how popular they are now amongst puppy millers.
    image
    Bowdu 寶肚 (Shiba) and Bowpi 寶媲 (Basenji) with M.C.
  • shibamistressshibamistress
    Posts: 5171
    Yeah I hate how often you see the Shibas. :(

    Wow, the instructions on housing, etc. were interesting. Things like you need to provide them water at least two hours a day?!? And you know, even if every commerical breeder followed these instructions, and had the neat, lean places in the photos, it would STILL be bad for the dogs. Everyone knows that living out a dog's life at the shelter, say (and it looks like some of the idea is to aim for what a good shelter looks like) is still not good for dogs, and no one wants them to be there their entire lives. And so even an "ideal" clean commericial breeding situation is still not good for dogs. Of course, the vast majority of mills come no where near the "ideal" situations outlined in this course.

    I was interested in the fact they suggested dogs get exercise, as I suspect many mills don't bother with that at all.

    One thing I will say about Bel's place--yes, it was a commercial breeder who did no health testing, etc. Obviously, Bel is a mess. But I think they were aiming at being a better rather than worse commercial breeder. When I saw them 8 years ago, they had clean indoor/outdoor runs for the dogs, like in a boarding kennel. They had a big fenced in area where the dogs were able to exercise. the dogs were clean, though clearly unsocialized and starved for contact. They gave me a good packet of info about Bel, and I will say that at least the owner was willing to take Bel back if I couldn't keep her (after Bel nearly killed Toby).

    So, Bel's mill (at it was a mill) was probably one of the better ones. And look what a disaster she is. The thing is, no mill is "good" regardless.
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    This bust happened maybe 35 minutes from where I live. It's getting a little to close for comfort!

    Thank God there are good people who pay attention and are not afraid to report these idiots.

    I'm sure they will only get a slap on the wrist(a shame), but at least, for now, they are shut down!

    http://www.brantnews.com/news/spca-seizes-more-than-80-dogs-from-west-dumfries-road-home/


    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    It's been a while, so thought this one needed a bump.

    Look at that little doggie in the window....now look at what it's parents look like....

    Photobucket Pictures, Images and Photos

    Sorry for the aweful pic, but can't stress enough that buying from pet stores and online sites such as Kijiji, the above photo may be what you are supporting. I realize that it's heartbreaking to see a cute, maybe even pitiful, pup at that pet store. It's only human nature to want to help. The pet store staff gives you the typical BS...the pup is NOT from a mill. At least one parent is registered, and comes from good lines. Of course, the minimal health checks were done. All hunky-dory it would seem. But, of course, all is not.

    This photo, that came to me via facebook, really got me churning! I can't stress enough that ignorance is NO excuse. It is SO important to do your research while trying to find a pup of any breed. Avoiding pet stores and online sites(unless proven reputable), will go a long way to eliminating mills. Only buy from reputable breeders and rescue groups.

    Here in Canada, many major cities have passed laws making it illegal to sell any pets in pet stores. The city closest to me, London, Ontario, is in the process of reviewing this potential legislation...crossing my fingers!

    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3664
    @Kobe1468 - To your knowledge, is that dog in the picture supposed to be alive or dead? I know it sounds like a morbid question, but that poor pup is so bad off that I didn't realize it was a dog at first. Thought it was what was shaved off or found in their cages.
    image
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    @Calia...I hope, for this particular dogs sake, that it is dead. So sorry to say that, but what a mess!!

    The Facebook post did not say if it was alive or dead. I can only assume that this dog, if alive, could only wish to be dead. Again, not a happy thing to say, but the years of obvious neglect and abuse at the hands of a mill(the post did say it was a mill dog) have beaten this dog into obvious submission.
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    I just got a response from the source of this photo. The dog is alive, and has been rescued!
    Remarkable!!!
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • That is utterly appalling, but glad the dog was rescued!

    And yes, this is what I think when people talking about "rescuing" their puppy from a mill, when they mean buying a dog from a mill or pet store. I think, yes, well, you know the parents of that dog are still there, suffering, and you've just supported a business that makes money by letting dogs suffer.

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