After reading about a horrible black Friday auction of dogs for a the puppy mills, I've just felt such terrible despair--what can I do to help these dogs that have such terrible lives? There's probably no answer to that, but one small thing we can all do is to educate others about mills--what they are, how to recognize them, and how not to support them. Like many of you, I really had no idea what a mill was before I joined this forum, and I had actually gone out to a mill (yes, in person!) and bought a Shiba from one, all without really knowing what I was doing! So many of us here have puppy mill dogs because we didn't know any better, and while we love our dogs, I don't think any of us want to support the horrible businesses they came from.
So I thought it might be useful for us to have a place here on the forum to consolidate a lot of information on mills in one thread. Part of it can be education: what is a mill, how do you spot one, etc. Part of it, I hope, can be action: suggestions from people on how to try to stop the mills or to support groups that either rescue dogs or try to work at closing down mills. I would like to know if there are groups that are trying to work on shutting down mills (groups that are still dog friendly, not like PETA obviously!) or if there ways I can, with limited time and resources, still help a bit. If people have suggestions, I'd love to hear them.
In the meantime, here are some links that will give people more information. Our own "Spot the Puppy Mill" thread is a great tool for getting educated about the ways in which mills try to hide/disguise themselves:
Those links were taken from this thread here on the forum, from someone who--like many of us--didn't know she was buying a puppy mill dog. At least Foxy's story has a happy ending as she has a good, loving home:
There are many of us here that have puppy mill dogs, so this is in no way a judgement--it's education. If you're new to learning about puppy mills, like all of us were at some time, check in with the threads of people who have mill dogs to see what their experiences are. I know in my case, I have ended up with a dog how had no socialization and is extremely fearful. She has a seizure disorder. She had a luxating patella and then a torn ACL. She injured my other Shiba so badly he nearly died. I have spent well over $10,000 on her (or vet bills from other dog from injuries she caused) in the 6 years I've had her. I love her, of course, but I hope that no one else has to go through what I've gone through with Bel.
Please add other links to information about puppy mills, or share your experiences, and I'd really love to see information about ways we can work for change, whether it is through supporting rescue groups or organizations that are trying to shut down mills. I'm sure I've missed stuff already on the forum, too, so please feel free to add it.
Thanks a ton Lisa, Puppy mills makes me sick so sad it's allowed.
Education is best thing to do and direct people to good breeders you know.
I don't hate pups who are from puppymills things happen and it's great they have a home.
Pearly my first boxer was from a family who breed their boxer to show their kids miracle of birth or for money not sure, Junior who knows where he came from dad got him without us being here my guess a bad breeder because his nose was really long compared to Pearly and Bella he almost looked like a boxer mixed his fur felt different from Pearly, Bella and other boxers I've met.
Bella is from a backyard breeder dad wanted a dog right now and he looked at kijiji and had to have her. Impulse buys is one reason pet stores is not good..
I hope for one day this will be stopped and outlawed in all countries.
I think it's often a delicate tightrope act for rescuers who actually work with the millers to release breeding adults. Puppymillers are often only willing to do so under the condition that they won't be badmouthed or publicly shamed. Rescues certainly don't want to make it easy for puppymillers to get rid of their unwanted stock, especially by just buying adults and pups off their hands, but they really want to save those dogs.
I don't have any experience with how to organize or legislate, but here a couple of state-level groups that can provide a model of how animal welfare advocates organize at a more local level:
I often wonder if the best (and only) way to get rid of puppy mills is for someone who has unlimited resources to go into the business, actually pay for genetic tests, socialization, temperament testing, good care for the dogs, etc, and then undercut the puppy-millers that exist. It would be a total loss for anyone to do this; they would have to have another source of income in order to support the "business," etc, but it does seem like the only way, to me, to get rid of these businesses because, well, I lack faith in humanity. I just don't see impulse buys and people who want instant gratification ever going away, no matter how educated they are about where the dogs come from.
The problem with a model like this, of course, is that it still gets dogs to people who will later abandon them for stupid reasons and I wonder if that would be worth the trade off humanely mass-produced puppies (which I think is possible but exceedingly unlikely due to my above-mentioned lack of faith in humanity) as opposed to the current puppy mill system. After all, if I believe there will always be people who buy from pet stores and whatnot even when they are educated, then the idea that there will always be people who dump their poor dogs at shelters, etc, is a corollary. So I suppose the question is, which problem can we solve and what attainable solutions are better for the dogs?
I'll make a note here that I'm in favor of tight regulation concerning the breeding of dogs because this simply isn't something I believe the market will solve. The problem is that I also question the ability to regulate in such a way as to fix the problem. Sure, you can demand genetic testing, and more humane living conditions but there's more to that if you want to treat a dog well, as we all know. How can you regulate something like how much time gets spent with a dog in any enforceable way? And mightn't unenforceable laws be worse than none at all?
Thanks for posting the links in one place. I certainly don't look down on shibas from puppy mills. It isn't their fault where they were born or that they were born. I have a puppy mill shiba that I adopted from a rescue & I love him the same as my shiba from a reputable breeder. I would never knowingly purchase a shiba from a puppy mill & I suspect/hope most people would not do so. Education is the key. I feel if you want any pure bred dog, then find a reputable breeder. If you think it is too much work to find one or you do not want to wait for a puppy from an reputable breeder, then do the right thing and adopt a dog from your local rescue. There are way too many homeless dogs that need homes.
We got Maya from a breeder recommended by a friend, but if it weren't for her, I might have gotten a mill dog myself. We did much research on the breed itself, but didn't find much information on where to get a Shiba. I was googling around, and all the fancy websites that came up are all from puppy mills. Till this day, I felt I was really lucky that I talked to the friend before making the decision.
I'm with Rhondabee here in that I'd never look down upon a dog from a puppy mill. Now, the people I look down on are the ones who knowingly go out knowing about the pet stores and puppy mills and still support those places. I understand the first time someone gets a dog and doesn't know any better, but by returning to a place like that for another dog is what gets me extremely irritated. I hope to see puppy mills shut down in my lifetime, but it's going to take a lot of work and educating the public.
The best way to undercut puppy mills is for people to have a better buying option so mills are put out of business. To me, that points to reputable breeders needing to (responsibly) breed more dogs for pet homes. Current laws and restrictions make it hard to do this and maintain high standards of health testing, care, spay neuter contracts, etc, unless of course you are one of the USDA licensed people, or a mass producer like RPK who cuts corners.
More and more it seems like the small breeders who do really wonderful jobs and strive for excellence are the ones who get targeted and penalized. Then there is the misconception that breeding more than a few times a year, or owning more than a certain number of dogs means you are a puppy mill. That just isn't so. I firmly believe if more decent breeders offered more puppies and made them more available, it wouldn't be such an uphill battle with the really nasty mills that do such horrible things to dogs.
Shiba rescue in Oregon is trying to make space for 20 or so Shibas that are being purchased at auction somewhere in the mill belt. The mill is liquidating stock, but still wants to make money if they can by selling the old breeder dogs as that saves them from the cost of shooting them. Lots of them will be sold for $5 as they are spent and no longer young. Sad how these dogs entire lives amount to $5 or less, and many will not be saved.
The goal for rescue is to save without enabling the mills to make more. So, they will buy as many of the dogs as they can and remove those dogs from breeding, but it doesn't fix the big problem. People buy from petshops and internet mill sites because they cater to impulse buying and are widely available. A step in the right direction, would be for more reputable Shiba breeders to keep websites, and offer more puppies. Easier said then done I realize.
Masakado Shiba Inu www.masakadoshiba.wordpress.com "Common sense isn't so common"
I agree with you Lindsay, better availability from actual reputable sources would be a huge step in the right direction. It means that people could accidentally stumble onto the RIGHT source instead of the wrong one.
I really believe that the reputable breeders should advertise on websites like nextdaypets.com and whatnot. It would put better options for everyone to see on those websites as we've seen some of those dogs listed on these websites sometimes barely look like shibas, and if the breeders keep screening homes properly as they've been doing, I think it'll be a better way for people to get educated from them as well.
They were only able to save 12 of Shelba Canfields dogs which she sent to the auction block. I guess the prices were too high for rescue to buy more, and lack of foster homes, so 50ish Shibas were sold off to other puppy farmers to live miserable lives. That's all very telling of the increasing popularity of this breed, and the direction I fear the Shiba Inu is heading.
Another breeder/rescue friend and I pledged $200 towards the dogs, so I hope that makes a difference for at least one of them. Can you believe, with all the "shares" and "likes" on Facebook, that only a handful of people have actually sent money or agreed to foster? What they really need is foster homes and funds. Pam Peterson at Royal Kennels is helping with this case, and can be contacted directly for donations or foster volunteers.
Masakado Shiba Inu www.masakadoshiba.wordpress.com "Common sense isn't so common"
@Lil_Washu, yeah, we knew they were from the Brooklyn Hills kennels. It's in the other thread.
@Lindsay, that is utterly heartbreaking, but thanks for keeping us posted. Can you tell us which rescue is handling these dogs, so we can send donations if we're able? I see it's the Oregon rescue...if I find it I'll link it here, but if you see this first, could you?
I do think that better availability from good sources would help at least some. It's so difficult to find a responsible breeder--first to learn how to identify one, and then to get a response from people! I am beginning to the think that having good breeders on Next day pets, and sites like that as Lindsay and Araks mentions might actually be useful after all, as is more good breeders producing puppies for pet homes.
I'm just devastated, too, about what is happening to the breed. This kind of popularity can destroy the breed. What's working against Shibas is there size and cute puppy factor. I know that larger dogs end up in mills too--there were, for example, mastiffs for sale in that auction, and I know awhile ago there was a bust of a horrible place that had Akitas stacked in cages--but the smaller dogs certainly are more popular with mills and with impulse purchases. I wish I knew what to do.
I think, to avoid utter despair which will make me feel utterly helpless, I'm going to work on this in the small ways I can, which is through education, and donations to groups that either do rescue or help with stopping mills. It's also why I wanted to have a thread here, so we could find things that are within our means to help. It feels overwhelming, but I would rather be doing something, even if it is small, rather than nothing.
Thanks for the links here, esp. some of the ones curlytails posted...those help in education.
@Lindsay....I still can't find out who rescued the Shibas from the auction? could you link some info. for us?
The dogs are going back to Pam Peterson in Ohio (Royal Kennels). They though they were getting more, so the Oregon rescue had offered to step up and take 20, but the Ohio rescues were actually the ones involved in pulling the dogs.
Can someone who is knowledgeable about rescue/fostering maybe start a thread about what to consider before committing to foster a shiba? I would love to see advice and stories from people who have done it. I have thought about fostering, but honestly it's kind of intimidating. There is a ton of great info about adopting a rescue out there, but I haven't found as much about what to expect when fostering. Then I see situations like this where rescues are in need of foster homes, and I feel bad for not learning more before now....
No problem. 6 of them are going to Oregon to be fostered. Anyone in Oregon or Washingon can also donate to Shibas4life if they wish. They are also a wonderful Shiba rescue.
Masakado Shiba Inu www.masakadoshiba.wordpress.com "Common sense isn't so common"
"I agree with you Lindsay, better availability from actual reputable sources would be a huge step in the right direction. It means that people could accidentally stumble onto the RIGHT source instead of the wrong one."
This. I was very lucky to have stumbled onto the right website and even luckier that the great breeder was closer to me than a less than reputable one whom I was also considering. Sad to say, I learned everything I should have learned AFTER I got my Shiba.
emmy: Fostering differs a bit from organization to organization as do policies and requirements..... and even the people dynamic. If you are interested in specifically fostering a Shiba talk with the closest group to you listed on shibas.org
Here is a link on some things that are pertinent and give you an idea (the page is not breed specific) http://fosterdogs.com/
Speaking from my own experiences, I think the biggest and most important issue for us in fostering has been integration and making sure introductions and interactions among dogs remain smooth. Unlike many other breeds, one most likely will not be able to pour Shibas together and stir expecting them to get along right off the bat. It takes some planning and separation of spaces to really get the best results. Overall house training has been the least of any issues in fostering this breed.
Please speak with your local Shiba rescue and see if you can find a mentor to help you with the process since it is a lot tougher if you don't have the support. I don't know all the groups available or can speak for them individually....but I do know NYCSR has lots of activities and also Shibas4Life has a wonderful person as its founder.
I sent a donation to tri-state Shiba rescue. I couldn't afford much, but I hope even a little bit is helpful. Looks like they'll have the mill rescues up on the site soon.
A few weeks ago I helped to transport to her foster home a 5 year old female shiba given to rescue by a mill. She was as sweet as can be, but she had a severe luxating patella, which will require surgery and glaucoma in one eye that had to be removed because it was caught too late. Think about how many puppies this shiba had, who were sold to unsuspecting people, who ended up with shibas that may suffer from luxating patellas and glaucoma. I don't know who the breeder is, but they probably have a website that tries to fool people into thinking they are reputable. Please do your homework, and I really think that contacting your closest shiba rescue and checking with them about a breeder before purchasing from the breeder is a safe way to avoid a puppy mill. The rescues know who to avoid.
Forbes magazine has been running a couple lengthier articles on pets. First part on the economics of purchasing a purebred puppy have a lot to do with many topics discussed here about just what you're getting when you pay XXXX dollars for a well-bred pup.
the petstore we got brewster from was finally shut down by the akc and went out of business...we got him as they were "clearancing theyre inventory" and what that meant was "buy the animals cuz if you dont they will be put down" we got no real discount on the lil furball but we are happy to know we saved him from death that he didnt deserve..i want it known thart we DO NOT support mills ,we did know he was from a mill but we couldnt let him be put down
My company in Columbus, OH helped gain some of the initial signatures for a petition to end puppy mills in Ohio. Hoping we will get a contract so we can gather the rest of the signatures. Then we can make sure they get all they need...then it can get on the ballot and the people would be able to vote to end them!
@BrewSter: I personally think it's a lot different to get a pet store pup when they're being shut down and clearing out their inventory. You're not adding to the puppy mill demand, then, as the store is being shut down. Instead, I think that in your particular situation is much more like rescuing an animal. Glad to know both that you're giving a puppy mill dog a good life and that you managed to do it in a responsible way.
