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Emigrating with my Shiba
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    My husband and I are currently living in the UK but he's Canadian and we're thinking of emigrating back to Canada. Has anybody ever done this with their Shiba before? I'm worried she'll get stressed. Any Canadian Shiba owners here? - The UK is so mild, both winter and summer compared to CA, how does your Shiba deal the temperature extremes?

    [changed category ~mod.]
    Post edited by curlytails at 2013-03-20 20:57:14
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    I live near London, Ont. This has been Kobe's first winter and he has dealt with it just fine. He LOVES the snow, and the freezing temps haven't seemed to to phase him. I'm not talking NWT or Yukon cold of course, but he's seen down to -20C and was ok for short walks. Minus 5-10C has been the norm, and he's been really good.
    As far a stress from moving goes, I can't help you. I would imagine it would be stressful, more or less depending on the dog, but properly managed, would be tolerated.
    Good luck with everything! What part of Canada are you thinking of moving to?
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    This might help with importing your Shiba.

    http://inspection.gc.ca/animals/terrestrial-animals/imports/policies/live-animals/pet-imports/dogs/eng/1331876172009/1331876307796


    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • curlytailscurlytails
    Posts: 2779
    Yeah, start checking into the paper work and importation rules NOW if you think it will be even remotely a possibility. Cross-check with individual airlines too. It might be costly, but it's worth it in the long run.

    My partner and I emigrated from Taiwan back to the States by air, through Canada. Vancouver was okay, but I must say that I we had an absolutely horrendous time with ground crew in Toronto, through no fault of Air Canada. We had a frantic moment for about an hour where we actually thought they might have misrouted our dog. But that was just us, and many MANY years ago now, and maybe an aberrant experience overall...

    Bowdu did not appear stressed by the flight itself. A little dazed, but no worse for the wear. I was relieved that he didn't even soil his own crate during the longest leg of the trip (12 or 13 hours). But he did develop some separation anxiety after we moved, understandably, so that was something we had to work on after FINALLY getting settled into our new home in the States.
    image
    Bowdu 寶肚 (Shiba) and Bowpi 寶媲 (Basenji) with M.C.
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Thanks for all the advice everyone. We're thinking of moving to Toronto where all my husband's family are. We met in Vancouver but lived in Toronto together for a long time, it was our intention to live in the UK and to get UK Citizenship for Jeff but because of the state of everything here right now we're re-evaluating our plan.

    We think we can bring Shinobi onto the plane as hand luggage. Wouldn't it just be awful if she Shiba screamed the whole way there though?! The flight would probably get grounded somewhere!

    I know what you mean about Border Control for Toronto, those guys are hardcore! I nearly got denied entry one time and I'm married to a flippin' Canadian! I would have been absolutely bricking it to think Shinobi had been redirverted somewhere :0 I'm glad it was all OK.

  • BootzBootz
    Posts: 3485
    @curlytails, omg that is scary. I would have freaked the hell out at the airlines

    @RAM25, as curlytails mentioned, do your research now. I know some countries don't allow dogs to be carry ons and must be in cargo area...followed by a week long quarantine. Also if you are allowed to bring him as carry on...where is he going to go potty? o_o
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    @Bootz, Canada does not quarantine domestic animals. They even recognize the UK as a rabies free country, so her Shiba wouldn't even need rabies. ( they do encourage rabies vaccinations). And dogs over 8 months don't need a health certificate. But you are both correct, the airline may have certain requirements, so yes, research!!
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Yes, UK is rabies free luckily. It's only a 6 and a half/7 hour flight to Toronto, she's done longer car journeys, non stop before :) I've done the research on importing UK pets to Canada and it seems quite 'easy' or at least straight forward to bring her over. I think Air Canada allows little dogs as carry on but as you said I'll have to do more research.

    It's more the stress it would cause her potentially that's worrying me.
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    http://www.aircanada.com/en/travelinfo/airport/baggage/pets.html


    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • We're in Toronto! There is a great group of shiba owners on Meetup.com. I'd highly recommend joining. There were about 50-60 shibas at the 2012 Christmas party. It was a lot of fun.

    I can't give advice on air travel, but I can say that Tess loved all the snow we got this winter. Anything colder than -10 (celsius) and she didn't enjoy walking for too long. Her paws would get cold and unfortunately she won't wear boots. We haven't experienced extreme summer heat with her yet, so I can't comment on that.

    Good luck with your journey to Toronto!
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  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Oh thank you! I miss Toronto like you wouldn't believe! It's going to be a big priority for us to meet some Shiba people when we go over there - there are no Shiba's here. Shinobi is still puppy enough to love other dogs, especially spitz dogs - I'd love to see her face meeting 50+ other Shiba's!

    I think she'd like the snow also :D As for summer, it's a good job they shed! My Mother in Law has 2 black labs and they pretty much just sit by the air con all summer panting ;)
  • DjinnDjinn
    Posts: 161
    At some point we will have to fly our guys from Japan to Australia. Not only a long flight but into the opposite season... please keep us updated on how your move goes.
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Oh wow, good luck with your flight. I'd be interested to hear how your flights etc. go too! We're in the process of beginning to apply for my visa, the processing time from the UK averages at about 8 months, so I might not have a story for quite some time! I will keep you updated if I get any good tips etc :)
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    To all Toronto people:- could you please tell me if a dog must be altered over there by law? Also, how does the licensing thingy work? I've reasearched this only and I'm still a little confused.

    Thank you for any info!
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    I'm not from Toronto but looked this up. Here's a link about licensing:

    http://www.toronto.ca/animal_services/licensing.htm

    I'm not aware of any Province wide laws/bylaws that require pets to be altered. I tried looking it up and didn't find anything about any laws/bylaws specific to Toronto. Hoping someone from Toronto might be able to help you more.
    Good luck with the whole visa process!
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Oh thank you :) that's very kind of you. I'll check out the link now
  • There is definitely no law requiring altering of your pets. We meet a lot of unaltered dogs at the dog park...

    As for the licensing, I'm not really sure how it works. We haven't done it yet. I keep meaning to look into it, but I haven't yet. I'm not sure how strictly it's enforced. I don't see how they really could enforce it. I should probably follow that link @Kobe1468 posted, too!
    Photobucket
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Thank you! That's a relief. We haven't made up our minds about when to spay her yet. (My cat died after her spay and I have never got over the guilt/heartache - plus I have hypothyroid disease and would not wish to inflict it on my pup my upping her chances of getting it)

    My Mother-In-Law wouldn't take her dogs out until they were licensed so I thought it might be a law thing...

    Thanks again!
    X
    Post edited by RAM25 at 2013-04-08 14:23:43
  • BitiBeaBitiBea
    Posts: 234
    In regards to temperature, my Shiba LOVES the Canadian winter :D Me on the other hand......not so much :S
    *´¨)
    ¸.•´¸.•*´¨) ¸.•*¨)
    (¸.•´ (¸.•` Kismet & BitiBea~*.
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    @nikolatesla...I think the fine for not having your dog licensed is around $240. Might not be a bad idea to look into it, especially if you are active with your dog, in and around dog parks and the like. I live out in the country yet there is a bylaw officer who comes around our area from time to time to make sure our pets are licensed! I can only imagine they have them in the city as well.
    I don't think licensing is unreasonable, and actually will help, should your dog happen to end up in the pound at some point. It's much easier for them to reference the license tag rather than trying to ID via a chip or tattoo.
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • I agree, I think licensing is a very good thing. If they are knocking door to door in Toronto, they'd need about 50 bylaw officers exclusively for pet licensing! I highly doubt they are doing that in a city as large as Toronto. Given the number of dogs I see that aren't wearing tags (as the licence stipulates), I think there are a lot of people that do not licence their dogs. But, as you said, it's a good idea if you ever get separated from your pet. I think it's also a good idea to curb pet hoarding and abuse. I just wanted to give my personal opinion, which is that @RAM25's dog will not be taken from her if she does not immediately licence her! Or anything else extreme like that. But that's just my opinion :)
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  • demarcostdemarcost
    Posts: 16
    We will likely consider a big move like this within the next 5 years. In addition to any temperature changes, and any requirements in the destination country, one thing I know would be a concern for us is the stress from the change. We have brought our boy Ronin on vacation in the past and it didn't seem to upset him, but about a year after we got him we moved our bedroom furniture around... within a couple days he developed a lick granuloma, and moving the funiture was the only thing we could think of that could have brought on the additional stress. Thankfully it went away after time and we havn't had any issues since. But you may want to keep an eye our for that and other stress related issues, and be especially vigilant if your shiba has had stress related conditions before.
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    BitiBea said:

    In regards to temperature, my Shiba LOVES the Canadian winter :D Me on the other hand......not so much :S



    Gosh I know! The first Canadian winter I ever had was in Vancouver 2008 when they had a crazy unusual snowfall. I thought that was bad. The second winter I had in Toronto I nearly died! I had never experienced being that insanely cold before!

    Thank you all for the liscensing info. We have her registered here with the UK Kennel Club and she's microchipped and always wears her ID tag when outside (that's a legal requirement here too), so I guess it's pretty similar. I think it sounds like a good idea :)

    Shiba's do seem to have a very specific way of doing things. We made the 'mistake' of letting Shinobi up on the bed one morning and it has now become a major issue; even if we're getting up really early we have to make sure that she's on our bed with us for at least 10 minutes - if we don't she'll refuse to leave the room and keep trying to get on the bed - ha! I can really see how a big routine change would freak her out. It's pretty much my major concern actually :( I wish we could stay here but thanks to some harsh visa changes that's no longer possible.

    On a lighter note:-
    photo DSC00044_zps7fab0a15.jpg

    photo DSC00042_zps0e22b4b2.jpg

    Look at that face!
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    She's beautiful!! Kobe's favorite place is on the bed as well, likes to hide his bones under the covers!!
    I think most healthy dogs will adjust fine to a move. It might take time to get used to the new environment, but as long as the owners are adjusting, the dog should as well. I moved my two Samoyeds from Seattle to Ontario Canada. It took them a bit to adjust, but were fine. I think they had more of a problem adjusting to my wife!!
    I don't know if Shibas would be any different. Ive never moved with a Shiba, but can't imagine it would be any different...although they are definatly different dogs!!

    @RAM25, just curious, are you applying for permanent residence or a work visa? It took me just over a year to get my permanent residence status. That was, oh, 15 years ago. Hopefully things will move quicker for you!! Good luck!
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Hello
    Kobe1468

    Thank you! She is a bit of a cutey, I do find it hard to say no to that little face :) Thank you for your advice about moving. Good to hear :D

    Well, I had a work visa for Vancouver before which I got when I was a baby, 18 or so, which was a casual year work visa thingy...whilst away I met the ol' hubby and we got married a little later in Toronto. I then lived in Toronto for about 8 months on an extended holiday visa with him. We then made the decision for him to move to the UK which has turned out to be a mega mistake - the government here has gone extremely anti-immigrant and he is on an initial sort of 'probationary period' visa which is due to expire in little over a year - they've now changed up the rules for his next permanent residence visa and we're not really eligible anymore...plus they've also upped the price of the visa and we wouldn't be able to afford it anyway (the premium service is now £6000 would you believe?!) which has kind of blown our world apart a bit...

    but like a Shiba we must adapt! Therefore it'll be a family visa for me - spouse visa. We've been married for about 3 years now so I hope it wouldn't be too hard for us to obtain the visa, I know it takes quite a long time though...:/ Gosh if Canada said no I don't know what we'd do. Sad when a married couple can be denied the right to live together for financial reasons based entirely on paranoia that we'll end up on benefits (we've never claimed anything and no where near need to!)

    Sorry, little rant there :)

    Post edited by RAM25 at 2013-04-10 12:44:36
  • A Canadian friend of mine married a UK resident in 2009 after living there for a couple of years. He was able to emigrate to Canada with no problem a little over a year ago. I know visa/emigrating issues never seem to go the same for different people, but if he was able to do it not too long ago, you should be fine :)
    Photobucket
  • RAM25 said:

    Thank you! That's a relief. We haven't made up our minds about when to spay her yet. (My cat died after her spay and I have never got over the guilt/heartache - plus I have hypothyroid disease and would not wish to inflict it on my pup my upping her chances of getting it)

    My Mother-In-Law wouldn't take her dogs out until they were licensed so I thought it might be a law thing...

    Thanks again!
    X



    Spaying won't cause hypothyroidism, or as far as I know, even up the chances of her getting it. And luckily, hypothyrodism in dogs is pretty easy to treat. Also, there are plenty of good reasons to spay, one is that it will avoid pyometra which is deadly.

    On the immigration issues, though, you have my sympathy. It's a major pain. My husband is German, and we went through the first round of getting his permanent residency in the US and it cost a fortune. Now we're working on the extension, and it's time consuming, expensive and just ridiculous. Once you start going through the process, you really see why some people don't do it legally--they make it very, very difficult to do things the right way.
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Thank you! I'm just iffy on the spaying side of things because I had a very dear cat die from the operation and I guess it made me paranoid...I know there are a trillion good reasons to do it though and I'm sure I'll get over it and do what's best for my pup :) We actually just got back from our puppy class where we met another Shiba who came into heat when she was 6 months old, so I'm a little worried now that it'll happen way sooner than I hoped :/

    Eee sorry to hear you had to go down the immigration route too, you're completely right; they make you feel like a criminal for trying to do the right thing - the intrusion of privacy and the judgemental attitude is awful. The European Court of Law has very specific policy on not keeping married couples apart because of financial reasons, when I raised this with my local MP he told me that it wasn't a breach of my human rights because I could, and should, immigrate to Canada instead - so, if I can, I will!

    I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you and your husband as well.

    Thanks again,
    Post edited by RAM25 at 2013-04-10 15:57:01
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1587
    I'm really surprised about this. You are married, one would think they would make it easier on you! Can he not become a Citizen there?
    That's the nice thing about permanent residence in Canada. You only have to wait 3 years to apply for citizenship.
    Having gone through the process I can say that it's extremely intrusive. Keep on top of everything, KEEP RECORDS of EVERYTHING!!!!! I don't think they are necessarily trying to screw you, but they seemed to 'misplace' documents on a regular basis with us!! And inquire often. Any issues can be corrected much sooner if you keep them on their heels!
    If you need any advice through the process let us know. Would hate to see you separated from your hubby!! Good luck!
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Thank you, that's really kind of you.

    Ha! No. Just as an example; British Citizens must be earning £18,700 per year single handedly (no third party help allowed) to even be eligible to apply for a visa, any figure lower than this is case for instant visa rejection.

    Applied to real life this means that over 50% of UK citizens are now ineligible to marry a foreign born person and live with them here - the biggest demographic affected are young women and mothers. Having a child also doesn't help as you may think; for every child born the family must fork out an extra $5,000.

    The first visa was intrusive enough, it's tiring feeling like you've done something wrong just by falling in love.
  • Sorry to revive this thread, but have you immigrated to Canada yet?
    I live in Montréal and I must say, Molly loooves winter. She's gone out on minus 30 C and never showed any displeasure. The only thing she doesn't like is if she gets ice or salt (from defreezing the road) stuck in her paws, but thats not weather related.
    I must say it's a beautiful sight to see her jumping in the snow, going nuts about it.

    Sometimes there is more snow then her actualy height, but it doesn't matter, she stills venture in and pounce instead of running. It's hilarious :)
  • INU RYUUINU RYUU
    Posts: 1507
    Mushers Secret will help Molly's feet.

    http://musherssecret.net
    犬竜
  • RAM25RAM25
    Posts: 317
    Hello Molly-Shibette
    We have not yet emigrated to Canada. Right now we're preparing for my husbands next visa for the UK - the indefinite leave to remain. Plan A is definitely to stay here and get this visa but if it gets denied that's when we'll be going down the Canada route. I'm so nervous about it all to be honest, everything is very unsure. My main concern is what's best for Snoz, when we got her everything with the visa was sorted and we weren't worried, then suddenly the immigration rules got changed which technically makes us uneligible to my husband to live here! (Completely blind sided us.) It's all discretionary based for us right now, we had no idea we'd be in this situation when we got our dog which just shows that you really do have to be prepared for anything and have a contingency plan in place. It's sort of the 'worst case scenario' to have to emigrate (but not really, because I loooove Canada so much) I just want to have Plan B in place to ensure it would be as stress free as possible for Snoz should it happen.

    Montreal is so beautiful, that must be a really lovely place to have a Shiba :) I'm so jealous of all your snow! It never snows here...I hope you're all enjoying the funny Shiba snow antics! We're planning on going on a mission up North to chase some snow for Snoz over the xmas break :)
    Post edited by RAM25 at 2013-12-21 05:39:37

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