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Why do people not like black dog very much or think they aren't "cute" or whatever?
  • HaloHalo
    Posts: 278
    My little shiba I am getting is a black and tan. I think she is so adorable with her little white paws, but the breeder told me nobody wanted her because she was black. My boyfriend too, was even judgmental against her coloration and wanted to wait and see if guy had any other puppies later on this year that weren't black. She has a wonderful friendly happy personality. But people couldn't get past her looks. So sad. But if someone bought her, well, she wouldn't be coming home to me =) Shelters say they have tons of black dogs they have to euthanize because nobody wants them. I don't understand why they don't think they are cute? or look at their personality and get past the dog's looks? We don't judge our friends by how they look, why should we with our pets?
  • LosechLosech
    Posts: 2516
    I love, and prefer, black and darker colored dogs. Have two myself. However, I do not let color decide if I will get a particular dog or not.
    Post edited by Losech at 2013-01-24 09:57:23
  • redcattooredcattoo
    Posts: 1960
    I think Black and Tans are beautiful.

    I think the reason I didn't go that route was two fold 1) we had a choice between a male seasame and a female black and tan -- the female was very very shy compared to her brother so we went with her brother and 2) may not be right, but I have the thought process that in Florida that black coats make summer harder for the dog to be outside.
  • mbiblembible
    Posts: 7

    Black and tans are awesome- I think they look more dog like and less foxy. As puppies, they look like little black bear cubs. But choose based on personality and choose carefully. The color really doesn't matter so much as whether he/she is outgoing, healthy, well socialized, etc. You are going to love your dog no matter what color. And if your friends are judging your dog simply by color, then maybe you have a friend issue, and not a dog issue.

    Besides, Let's see a red shiba do this!!

    imageIMG_1776
  • ArcticArctic
    Posts: 513
    LOL what a great picture.

    I originally wanted a black and tan. I fell in love with them and I think they're absolutely BEAUTIFUL, not that red Shibas aren't. But like everyone else says, I didn't let color cloud my judgement or my breeder's advice, so I ended up with a red girl instead of a black and tan boy, which was my original "concept dog," if that makes sense.
  • ShibaLoveShibaLove
    Posts: 554
    Oh I think it is all personally preference. Some people like the creamies, some the red, I secretly drool over all of the photos of sesames on here. I could only get one at a time so I had to choose. My bf LOVES the black and tans and I think you will find many many on here that do too! I know black cats pile up at the shelters because of superstitions but maybe one reason for black dogs is people are worried about the hair showing up. Ha! It is going to show up everywhere any color it is though! Also I live in the south and @redcattoo's comment about the heat is something I would have to consider for my pets comfort. You also have to be careful with creamies in the sun though because they more easily burn and get cancer.
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3664
    When it comes to shibas, most people are looking for reds. It could be that reds look like foxes, or that they don't consider the b/t to look enough like a shiba. I had someone (who didn't own a shiba) yell at me because shibas apparently only come in red so my boy has to have some shepherd in him. Reds are often more sought out with breeders since they tend to show better than b/t.

    As far as black dogs in general, a lot of that falls under superstitions. In old fairy tales, a black dog is often used to portray an ominous figure that brings death and evilness. People take that to heart, having a somewhat fear of black dogs and expecting them to be more aggressive than a dog of another color.
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  • I have heard one theory is that black dogs (or at least dogs with black faces) are more difficult to "read".

    People can not as readily pick up their expressions, what their eyes are saying etc...Maybe that's why shelter dogs don't grab peoples hearts as quickly? I don't know..

    I've never heard people actively saying they don't like them though...

    I've never heard that about B&T's....B&T's are very popular here in Hawaii...
  • I think the few people who are familiar with Shiba's only know of the reds and possibly the red sesame (unless they are an owner or a breeder). I took my black and tan pup to Petland and one lady asked me if my dog was a Shiba. I told her yes and she was absolutley shocked that they came in black and tan. The shiba is not as well known as the more common breeds so I think people always just expect the red, foxy dog since it is the more common color. I have had lots of comments on how my dog must be mixed with something even after repeatedly telling them he is pure bred Shiba. I really dont care if people think he is mixed or what they think. I love my dog and that is all that matters. I think all colors of Shiba's are beautiful. @Halo I am really suprised that no one wanted the little black and tan girl because when I was looking for a black and tan it was really hard to find one and alot of breeders had waiting lists for black and tan puppies.
  • knnwangknnwang
    Posts: 645
    I like my B&T, I often get comments about how he looks like a little wolf especially when he is running and has his tail straight for balance I guess. One of my friends said it was a twilight dog.

    photo IMAG0919_zpseca94054.jpg
  • RikkaRikka
    Posts: 1501
    I hear in some Asian cultures that having a black dog brings bad luck, or some form of negativity, hence why some people have a disdain towards black dogs. Same thing with black cats, there's stupid myths about staring in a black cat, being around one, etc. I personally LOVE black, or dark, colored animals.

    My first preference was to be a black & tan. It's a huge bias, but seeing as how I'm not fond of the reds and the sesames seem to be even more rare to obtain, I went with a breeder who specialized in black & tan. I do feel you, OP. I HAVE gotten a comment from a homeless dude a couple months ago about how Sagan's a "killer dog" and he needs to "get the hell away from the city." Mind you, he was like, 4-months-old?

    I am, however, tired of the damn "MINI-HUSKY, RIGHT?" "HUSKY, YEAH?" "KLEE KAI, YEP!" from strangers. No. No. No. No. NO. *explodes* That's my only complaint of having a spitz-type who's black. It's always the people who assume incorrectly who can't even pronounce the breed name. "It's a whaaaaa? Shiboo ina? Can you spell that out?"

    image

    It makes Sagan sad with the amount of stupidity.
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    Lauren, living with a 4 y/o Shiba named after a scientist. ☆
    Post edited by Rikka at 2013-01-24 12:10:39
  • HaloHalo
    Posts: 278
    I love all the shiba colors. They all have their own unique look to them. I love all the pictures you guys posted! =) will be posting some pics of my new baby when i get her in 2 weeks. My last dog was also black. My boyfriend also made some comment about it looking like a mini-husky, lol. I don't think they look like huskies at all. You don't see huskies that are black and tan.
  • kumaDUDEkumaDUDE
    Posts: 1259
    @rikka is correct, some Asian cultures view black to be evil/bad luck... But I don't care, if I like the dog and tey like me, color won't stop me from having them.
  • HaloHalo
    Posts: 278
    @chantel, breeder had several black and tan puppies that were also male. 3 born in one liter. She was from a previous litter, and the breeder said the only people who wanted the black and tan wanted a male, and not her. Her siblings sold immediately, within a week of being born. They were the red colored puppies.
    (of course they weren't taken right away, lol, but they were paid for and claimed already)
    Post edited by Halo at 2013-01-24 12:24:08
  • RikkaRikka
    Posts: 1501
    Agreed, @Halo. They look nothing like huskies :-/ Even down to the minute details such as their ears, paws, and tails. Not to mention their obvious size differences -- even if it were a "mini", it'd look completely morphed and bugged-out. Klee Kai's scare me because of how borked they look. /hides
    image
    Lauren, living with a 4 y/o Shiba named after a scientist. ☆
  • LosechLosech
    Posts: 2516
    @Halo I have seen several black and tan huskies, Siberians, Alaskans, and mixes. That coloration is pretty rare in Siberians, but it does exist, and looks really awesome.

    I do not think Shibas look like huskies at all, nor foxes. I think they bear a stronger resemblance to Dingoes and Singers, but few people here seem to even know what those are. Kinda sad really.
    Post edited by Losech at 2013-01-24 12:28:00
  • HaloHalo
    Posts: 278
    i think the shiba/husky hybrids are very weird looking. I don't know why people do that. They turn 2 beautiful dog breeds into a strange looking mutt.
  • BootzBootz
    Posts: 3495
    As @Calia and @ Rikka mentioned. Black dogs are bad luck in different cultures. Jackie was all black with white paws (worst of the worst in Asian culture) but my mom overlooked it and took her in. She outgrew the white paws...but now she's getting gray hair XD.

  • HaloHalo
    Posts: 278
    I can't imagine believing my black puppy will bring me any bad luck, lol. I guess its what country and cultures people have been brought up in. I know in some countries they eat dogs...*shudders*...just nasty. I can't imagine eating my best friend/buddy.
  • SayaSaya
    Posts: 6678
    Calia said:


    As far as black dogs in general, a lot of that falls under superstitions. In old fairy tales, a black dog is often used to portray an ominous figure that brings death and evilness. People take that to heart, having a somewhat fear of black dogs and expecting them to be more aggressive than a dog of another color.



    Yeah many black dogs are seen like that it is sad. :\

    B&T shiba are cute and I can't believe people would think the same way about them as pure black dogs. It's sad people have bad thoughts on black dogs too.

    Saya enjoys summer though she is more sluggish, but any fluffy dog is sluggish she doesn't seem too affected by the sun. She is pretty smart to she'll move under the tree if it's really hot. Though we don't hang outside for long time, but she enjoys handing out in the yard.
    Walks in am and walks in late pm helps keep her cool.

    Saya is a sweet shiba and luckily no one has never been afraid of her due to her color.

    I mean look how pretty Saya is. :) B&T shiba rules. She looks nothing like black and white huskies.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Siberian-husky.jpg

    I get tired of husky, malamute, Alaskan klee kai, and so on. If you don't know her breed ask not spout out anything.
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    Nicole, 5year old Bella(Boxer), and 4year old Saya(Shiba inu)
  • curlytailscurlytails
    Posts: 2779
    Just as a side note, a pet peeve of mine is when we talk non-specifically about "Asian culture" ... as if Asian cultures are all one thing.

    Anyway, dittoing Bootz, I know black dogs with white paws are considered extremely unlucky amongst the Taiwanese who grew up with strong Buddhist-Daoist beliefs, because such dogs are said to have waded through or been "touched" by death (white being the color of death). But then you also have people who live at the same time, same place, like my aunt who specifically takes in dogs with those kinds of markings because they tend to be abandoned. She gives them auspicious names like "Lucky" or "Fortune" and finds that they make excellent, loyal guard dogs.

    Similarly, amongst the Taiwanese, a strong, spirited all-black Formosan Mountain Dog is highly prized by some indigenous breeders. Color is not a priority when you're looking at a good hunting dog, and if they've "got it," the color just adds to the boldness of character.

    I do think there's some truth to the idea that it's harder to "read" dogs with all black faces, especially if their eyes are dark too. It's certainly harder to photograph them! And when there are rows and rows of them in shelters, it's difficult to distinguish them... The different-looking outliers will tend to be more attractive to the average person who's there to pick out a pet. And honestly, a black and tan Shiba in a lineup of black dogs will not suffer the problems that plague the "generic" black shelter dogs...

    In short, who cares what "people" think? Cuteness is in the eye of the beholder.
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    Bowdu 寶肚 (Shiba) and Bowpi 寶媲 (Basenji) with M.C.
  • HaloHalo
    Posts: 278
    @saya. Your dog is really pretty! But all shibas are pretty! I think they are so cute, even as adults. I love their smiles!
    @curlytails. I think you are right about the shibas not being as over looked as an all black dog would be. It is hard to photograph an all black dog, but with the right lighting, it is possible, and I have gotten some very nice pictures of my all black toy poodle.

  • I think its down right idiotic to fear a dog because they are black. Booooooo!!! Talk about ditzy-dur. And i've also heard that in generalization of most breeds, black and white dogs are more friendly. Something to do with the genes or something. While i beleive this is also untrue, all dogs will be nice if your are nice to them(except some sad cases) at least it isn't prejudice and makes a friendly thought instead. Couldn't more people think thinigs like that? Or get a brain. That's good too.
  • jennajenna
    Posts: 154
    Black and tan was my first choice when I was looking for my first Shiba. Of course, now I have a black and tan, a red, and a sesame. I also had a red WOOLY at one point, but she's since passed away. Someday, I have to get a cream to complete my "collection," but I will always have a soft spot for the B&Ts!!!

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    jenna -> founder of nyc shiba rescue, inc.
    snickers -> master of shiba mind control
    jennaandsnickers.com
  • CaliaCalia
    Posts: 3664

    Just as a side note, a pet peeve of mine is when we talk non-specifically about "Asian culture" ... as if Asian cultures are all one thing.



    LoL, what I find funny was that it's not just an "Asian" thing. There are tons of myths and stories about evil black dogs originating from Europe and the US.
    http://stockton-heath.hubpages.com/hub/Lore-and-Legend-of-the-Black-Dog

    There are tales where the black dog is a spirit full of malice, stalking and eventually killing or maiming the main character. During the medieval times, seeing a black dog was an omen that death was soon to follow.
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  • jennajenna
    Posts: 154
    Meanwhile, I have a strong connection to Snick and have always felt that my dear black dog is my protector, both physically and spiritually. I wonder if that makes me evil, to be protected by a black dog?? ;)
    jenna -> founder of nyc shiba rescue, inc.
    snickers -> master of shiba mind control
    jennaandsnickers.com
  • Calia said:

    Just as a side note, a pet peeve of mine is when we talk non-specifically about "Asian culture" ... as if Asian cultures are all one thing.



    LoL, what I find funny was that it's not just an "Asian" thing. There are tons of myths and stories about evil black dogs originating from Europe and the US.
    http://stockton-heath.hubpages.com/hub/Lore-and-Legend-of-the-Black-Dog

    There are tales where the black dog is a spirit full of malice, stalking and eventually killing or maiming the main character. During the medieval times, seeing a black dog was an omen that death was soon to follow.


    Yeah, saying "Asian culture" without specifying which is like saying Native American--they are too different to be in one group. Aleuts are wildly different than Navajo who are wildly different from Mohawk, etc, etc.

    One thing I heard that was interesting about black dogs, though, and was a particular Asian cultural thing, :) was in north Vietnam, when a man was talking about eating dogs. He told me that he knew it was difficult for westerners, but he said it was all about good luck--dog was only eaten at a certain time of the moon phase, and he said "and it's not a western dog like a German Shepherd or something. We only eat small black Asian dogs for good luck." I had a black chow cross at the time and was horrified, but I also appreciated the explanation which was interesting. (This was in Hanoi). I did see puppies in the marketplace in a very small town near the Chinese border too (Sapa). It looked like the dark puppies were, indeed,preferred. I guess it was not lucky for the dogs, for sure, but if black dogs were considered bad luck, would people eat them for good luck?

    Of course, for us dog lovers not raised in a culture that eats dogs, this is horrific (and I declined when we had a dinner of dog, though others with us tried it), but it was still interesting, and speaks to the widely varied thoughts on black dogs. (on a side note, what I ate that night was a salad with strips of something salty and chewy in it, which I kept thinking seemed familiar, but I had no idea what it was. It was pigs ears!)
  • I think it's interesting that this has come up for people with their black and tan Shibas. I've never gotten anything but compliments on mine. Generally speaking I get told how "expressive" the tan dots above his eyes are ("he has little eyebrows"), how they didn't know that Shibas came in that color (I had one lady gush about how "rare" he was as a black and tan Shiba once in a pet store and how special he was that I actually started to feel uncomfortable) and I've also had other Shiba owners in town talk about how much they wanted a black and tan but couldn't find one. Honestly, the consensus seems to be that his coloring is the best thing since sliced bread and so I'd figured the whole black dog thing just didn't apply to Shibas.

    In any event, forget color and other people's opinions. It's your dog. Just make sure you have a reputable breeder who CERF and OFAs their dogs and breeds for temperament.
  • @Shibamistress - side note - Here in Hawaii it's a long standing joke about "black dog"...da bess kine fo eat....and I guess jokes come from somewhere -

    It is disturbing to people who don't live here, but people joke about it all the time and tease you if you have a black dog to keep an eye on it while it's young.... :)

  • HaloHalo
    Posts: 278
    @ Notoriousscrat
    What is CERF and OFA?
  • CERF stands for Canine Eye Registration Foundation and is a test that should be done yearly on the eyes of all breeding stock. It certifies that the dog is clear of certain inheritable eye diseases. OFA is the Orthopedic Foundation for Animals and is a test that should be done on the hips, knees and elbows of all breeding stock. It certifies that the breeding stock is clear of hip displasia, elbow displasia and luxating patella, all of which are inheritable conditions that can cost $1000+ to fix in a dog and can be very painful for a dog. Using these tests (or also Pennhip for the hips) on breeding stock is the best way to try and insure that any puppies produced do not get any of the inheritable conditions they test for, all of which are ones that affect Shiba Inus. These tests are something that all reputable breeders do.
  • JScarf5JScarf5
    Posts: 202
    I love all Shiba's, any color. But I secretly drool over the black and tans! I think they are so AWESOME!! I love the coloring in those little guys! I have a red whom I love to bits but if there happened to be a black and tan in my liter, depending on personality of course, I might have a black and tan instead. I just think its a personal preference but like everybody said, personality is key, no matter the color. All Shibas are BEAUTIFUL!!
  • JScarf5JScarf5
    Posts: 202
    @Saya - Saya IS gorgeous!! LOVE her coloring ;)
  • When I was first doing my research about this breed and decided I wanted one I looked at tons and tons of pictures and had decided I wanted a red female. I just thought the reds were prettier. I don't care for the Black and Tan as much where the tan is really really light. When I finally found puppies for sale and went to look at them I brought home with me a Black and Tan male puppy. And I think he's really cute. I don't think color really matters in a dog. Personality is number one priority when owning a dog.

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    Post edited by dmarie485 at 2013-01-24 17:42:53
  • My first shiba was red, and Kimura is red, too, but from the moment I first saw them, the black and tan were always my favourite. I love their eyebrows. I think they're stunning!
  • I personally love black dogs and I think Black and Tan shiba's are as good looking, if not better then Red.
  • tatonkatatonka
    Posts: 1210
    A wise man once said:
    If you're thinking of being my baby
    It don't matter if you're Black and Tan
    Monkey!
  • I love Black and Tan too! that was my first choice. Was planning to get a B&T Male Shiba....(not fair to Butter for me to make such statement now....cuz she is Red Female)...

    I picked Butter because her personality is more outgoing and active as a puppy vs. the B&T ones, also because she is so darn cute!

    @Saya, She is gorgeous!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wish i could meet someone like her when i get my 2nd dog
    Post edited by djiksong at 2013-01-25 18:31:54
  • motmot
    Posts: 13
    Here in Japan, Black and Tan is very popular color.(My shiba is B&T too).
    People think B&T is very stylish coloring.

    Red is symbolic coloring of NKs, but other colorings becoms much popular too!
    Post edited by mot at 2013-01-25 21:36:22
  • amtiamti
    Posts: 1066
    Wow, I had no idea of all this controversy regarding black dogs. Black labs are very popular in Texas. I love B&T shibas and would love to own one one day. When I lived in Japan, reds and sesames were very common. I don't recall seeing any B&T shibas, but it could be because I didn't know they came in those colors. It sure would help keep my wardrobe looking nicer if I had a black dog! We do have a black male cat. We have heard that shelters have numerous black cats up for adoption. People don't like black cats, I guess. We've had five cats total and two were black males. They had the best personalities and were wonderful kitties. One vet said he never met a black male cat that didn't have a great personality. I wish people would give them a chance. I know when our kitties go, we'll probably rescue another blackie just because they are so beautiful and we've had such great luck with them being wonderful souls.
  • i love the black shibas too! (i have a red one), but i think most people just think the red ones are the standard color, and decide to go with them since they are what shibas look like in their minds. i should be picking up a black shiba in the coming year, prolly over the summer when i'm done with undergrad.

    in general, we should love them all the same, whether theyre black white red sesame. all of them are just so adorable!
  • Our first Shiba was sesame, and our second was red, and now the one I currently have is black and tan. I honestly could care less about what color they are as long as they have a healthy coat, and the dog has a good personality. If I were to buy a puppy I would probably go back to the breeder I got my first dog from because she was just so amazing and I'd want something from the same blood line. Which would mean I would probably end up with a sesame or red shiba as that is all the breeder has.
  • aykayk
    Posts: 121
    Just to add a different angle to this, I've read somewhere that black/tan dogs with the eyespots above the eyes are said to be able to see things in the supernatural realm. ie. ghosts and such.
  • RikkaRikka
    Posts: 1501
    o_o;
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    Lauren, living with a 4 y/o Shiba named after a scientist. ☆
  • BootzBootz
    Posts: 3495
    @ayk,

    If you want to start on that topic....in Asian culture it's ALL dogs, not just Black and Tan.
  • zandramezandrame
    Posts: 1106
    But, but... black & tan shiba's aren't even black! They've got all that tan and white in there. And if you look at them in the light, you'll see the cool banding on the guard hairs of the underlying redish color under the black. ;)
  • jennajenna
    Posts: 154
    @zandrame, that is true! The black coat of a black and tan Shiba should be a dull black with a bronze or "rusty" cast to it, not a true, shiny black.
    jenna -> founder of nyc shiba rescue, inc.
    snickers -> master of shiba mind control
    jennaandsnickers.com
  • KentaKenta
    Posts: 236
    When I walk with Kitsu (Red) and Kenta (B&T), people also go awwww first at Kitsu. Kitsu gets 99% more attention and comments about how cute he is, then Kenta. But the people who made comments about Kenta, said he looked very beautiful, not cute, but beautiful.
  • RikkaRikka
    Posts: 1501
    Yeah, I think I received a few "cute" comments when Sagan was way younger, but even now, he only gets "handsome", "beautiful." It's interesting!

    I think the best compliment I've received recently was, "Your Shiba is such a ham. He's great to play with!" It was some woman at a dog park who playing fetch with Sagan, and he was actually bringing the ball back! After awhile of that, she leaned down and was swerving the ball left and right on the ground, and he was attacking it like a cat. She made some more comments about how she grew up with an Akita and they're "incredibly loyal, but stubborn," then made the remark how she heard that Shibas were "tenfold of stubborn than Akitas." I've never owned (or even seen!!) one before, but I agreed that Sagan can definitely be stubborn sometimes. =p
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    Lauren, living with a 4 y/o Shiba named after a scientist. ☆
  • Could there be a regional thing? A friend of mine who lived in Hokkaido for a year or two mentioned that while she saw a lot of shibas, almost all of them were black and tan so it was an adjustment when she moved back here.

    Out of curiosity, for the rest of you who own b&t shibas, are they generally more muscular than the reds you've seen? All the black and tans I've met are noticeably more muscular, but I think they are also all from a line coming out of a specific kennel in Japan so it could just be that line.

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