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Dog park people -_-
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1588
    This whole dog park thing has made me very curious. So tonight I was talking to my neighbour, who has had only a couple of experiences with dog parks.(he owns Pepper, Kobe's girlfriend). He's fairly neutral on the topic, so we agreed to go to London this Saturday and hit the busiest dog park in town!(we figure there's safety in numbers!)

    I feel like I've done a lot of great work with Kobe. He's well mannered, loves other dogs and people, and typically will listen when distracted. Pepper is a great Black Lab. She's as obedient as can be. I'm sure it will test them, but I'm pretty sure they are ready.

    As for myself, I'm pretty confident in my own skills, but am very nervous about what I'm going to deal with, in other owners. I've had a few incidents with mindless dog owners just while walking Kobe out here in the country. Should be interesting!

    So if I survive the thunderdome, without getting arrested, I'll give a report on my first visit to the dog park. Please keep your fingers crossed!!

    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • @Kobe1468
    Kobe1468 said:

    [...] He's fairly neutral on the topic, so we agreed to go to London this Saturday and hit the busiest dog park in town!(we figure there's safety in numbers!)



    Eep... are you sure you want to do that? You know I love my dog parks, so that said, let me caution you that high numbers are exactly the OPPOSITE of safety when it comes to these places. I avoid the busiest dog parks in town specifically on the weekends because they're overly trafficked, and swarming with non-regulars... which you both would be. I'm honestly not sure you'd be setting yourselves up for success there.
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  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1588
    @curlytails....I appreciate your wisdom and concern.

    My 'safety in numbers' comment was in reference that I'd be there with my neighbour, not that the park would be busy. We can kind of keep an eye on each other, and our dogs.

    I think we will plan to go early AM, and avoid the big crowds.

    My goal of this visit is, first of all, for Kobe and Pepper to have fun. I'm hoping my neighbour and I will have fun as well.

    Secondly, I just want to experience a visit to the dog park. After reading some of the stories in this thread, and articles and blogs about dog parks, I really want to experience it for myself. I want to form my own opinion on this subject, through experience.

    Maybe I'll love it and wonder why I hadn't gone before, and make it a weekly routine. Or I'll hate it and never return. Either way, I won't know until I try it.

    I would not even consider this if I didn't think I have set up Kobe for success...and I know Pepper will be fine. I'm more concerned about myself, and how I may react to stupidity(should it arise).

    But point taken...going at off peak times should make things a bit less stressful.
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kira_KiraKira_Kira
    Posts: 2482
    I just wanted to echo my opinion on the dog park experience - Kira is also well-mannered, very well-socialized, and not aggressive at all. That being said, I still refuse to take her to a dog park because all it takes is that ONE experience that does not go well to throw all the socialization and hard work down the drain.

    If you want to take your dog to a dog park and "set yourself up for success" I would pick the least busy dog park and possibly work yourself up to a more frequented park. Going to the busiest dog park at a "non-busy" time doesn't guarantee that the wrong dog won't be there... Or any dog park for that matter.

    I personally take Kira to friend's houses for puppy playdates, and allow Kira to meet strange dogs but not run free in a fenced area and play with them if I don't know the dog. Maybe I'm just paranoid, but I have a wonderfully rounded puppy and I don't want to ruin that.
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  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1588
    @Kira_Kira....that one experience could happen anywhere. I live in the middle of nowhere and have had issues with ignorant dog owners. I was put in a position where I actually had to pick Kobe up(when he was a pup) to avoid him being confronted by two dogs who were walking about a 1/8 mile, off leash, ahead of their a**hole owner.

    I've worked very hard with Kobe, and I have complete confidence that he will be fine in a dog park environment. And if needed, I have his back. I've danced the dance more than a few times.

    I'm more concerned with the other owners, thus the title of the thread.
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Kira_KiraKira_Kira
    Posts: 2482
    Too bad you don't have a doggie daycare near you. Very good ones regulate the dogs very well and the play environment can be similar to the dog park experience you are looking for.
    Except that shots and a fee are required.
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  • @Kobe1468 Ahh, I gotcha now. I agree that a dog park outing with a trusted friend can be quite a pleasant outing. As long as the numbers are low enough where everyone is mindful to keep an eye on their dogs (and watch out for others), instead of getting sucked into conversation, as can sometimes happen when too many friends congregate. I know you're very attentive and stay on top of your reading, which is why I was a little surprised at first when I thought you meant to throw Kobe onto the highway, as it were, without necessarily having gotten him down Main Street yet. Silly analogy, but it's actually fairly extendible... Accidents can occur at any time on any road, but some intersections are more hazardous than others, and weekends/rush hour traffic make things more likely to happen just because every additional car (and irate driver) ratchets up the statistical probability.

    Anyway, yes, I hope your dog park traffic is less dense in the AM, and that it's a positive experience!

    ED: Just wanted to clarify too that I don't actually think the "least busy" dog park necessarily has to be the first introduction, because it could be empty simply because the space sucks. In my area, the concrete dog runs underneath highway overpasses are often the "least busy" dog parks because they're not terribly exciting places for either human or dog. I don't think I'd bother with those parks even if they were the only option. Large, landscaped spaces at off-hour times would be my ideal first dog park experience, but it does take experience and research to figure out just when those off-hours are -- and of course, as a public, communal space, there's no guarantee that some group might not decide that specific off-peak time is a good day for a 20-dog Mini Schnauzer meetup or something. ;)
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    Post edited by curlytails at 2014-02-25 23:57:01
  • Kira_KiraKira_Kira
    Posts: 2482
    All the dog parks in my area are landscaped. I've never seen one in an industrial area. Odd.
    My city, although small, is extremely dog-friendly so maybe that's why. We even have a mall where dogs are allowed in the stores.

    edit: my phone sucks at grammar
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    Post edited by Kira_Kira at 2014-02-26 00:06:43
  • @Kobe1468 have you ever taken your dog for a walk in Regent's Park? I used to live in the area and people would bring their dogs there. Never saw a dog park but the park is vast and seeing as many people bring their dogs it maybe a better option to socialise your dog?

    That in mind; have your dog on a leash because there's lots of ducks, herons, geese, squirrels, and even rats. The only area where you're not allowed with a dog is Queen Mary's rose garden.

    ---

    I think it also depends on the dog park. When I got my dog I only knew one dog park and it was five minutes away from me. Since then I have found a much better one. It's only better because small/big dogs are separated and it's easier for my dog to socialise because there isn't any big dogs jumping on him or nipping him. Although there's still people..."dog park" people who'll ruin that atmosphere (there is a couple that being their two aggressive pitbulls and tell everyone else not to bring their dog into the big dog area until THEY'RE finished. There is also an old lady with one aggressive boxer and another one that isn't but she yells at the younger one who tries to socialise over the fence...) but overall I have had BETTER experience because there are more peaceful dogs.

    I think sometimes it's a far better option just to walk a dog in the biggest park in town. I took Yoshi to Kadriorg park once. He had an excellent time because of all the dogs there. Some barked and were aggressive (a Shar Pei and a Pom) but most of the experience was a lot better (like the Yorkies).

    I think it's just finding the right park.
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  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1588
    @Kira_Kira...Kobe used to go to daycare on a regular basis. I agree that daycare playtime is a more controlled environment. However, it's not without risks either. I know of at least one member here that had some doggie daycare woes.

    @poltergeist...are you talking about Regents Park in the UK? We are in London, Ontario. Is there a Regents Park in the GTA possibly?

    There are a couple of parks in London with some walking trails and are popular places to walk dogs. I've never gone to them, just because we live out in the country and have lots of open fields and quiet roads to walk on. But I agree, parks are another good alternative.
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • Ah sorry! London, UK.

    High Park in Toronto is your best bet. They even have a section just for walking your dog. I think High Park is the biggest park in Toronto, actually. Plus it's close to Lake Ontario and they have a boardwalk where dogs are allowed to walk.
    Many people in the High Park area have dogs so it's a good area for walks and socialising.
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  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1588
    We survived our first visit to the dog park! A few observations:

    Both Kobe and Pepper(neighbours black lab) had a blast. There had to have been at least 20 dogs there during the duration of our visit(coming and going). Kobe did very well with all of the dogs that cared to play with him. Kobe, Pepper, a male Boxer and a female Rotti/lab mix sort of formed a play group. They stuck together for most of our visit.

    But to the heart of this thread...the people. I took time to observe the other owners, and found them to be very engaged in their dogs, either by playing with them or keeping a close eye on them. I didn't see anybody being overly chatty, talking or texting on phones, or otherwise ignoring their dog. There was only one person who didn't clean up after his dog.

    This was only a very short sample of dog parks for me. I can't come to a overall opinion on dog parks in general. I'd be just as irresponsible as somebody who comes to a conclusion based on one study of a single dog park.

    I can say that I will be returning to this dog park. Kobe had a great time, as did I. We met some great people and some awesome dogs.

    One thing I would like to say is that you will only get so much out of something as you are willing to put into it. If you go into something with a already biased opinion, you will be sure to find faults, while most likely conveying some of that negative energy into your dog. If you go in with an open mind and are prepared for anything, you will most likely come out with positive results. Not saying there aren't rude people at dog parks, bad trainers/vets and so on. Just don't let the negatives outweigh the potential positives.

    See you at the dog park!
    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • poltergeistpoltergeist
    Posts: 426
    I feel like we should make another thread about people approaching our dogs in general. I was in a lift with my dog and two guys. One of them called my dog stupid (in Estonian) which so pissed me off. First of all, my dog doesn't know you. Hell, I don't even f*cking know you, what on earth makes you think that my dog is just going to accept you because you make calls and gestures towards him? He is shy, leave him alone. That doesn't make him an idiot. F*cking hell, what an asshole!

    *rant over*
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  • Poltergeist, I am working on a new trick with banjo where he "shows teeth"; the command is "fight". He has ZERO aggression issues towards any people, so its more for me to look like I have an attack dog than anything. I suggest trying it out so next time someone calls your dog stupid and you say fight and he looks angry, they'll be scared. Yes it's mean. Yes, It's funny (especially when I showed my friend who walks banjo every day and was there when I got him. Him and banjo are BFF's but when I showed him this trick he actually thought my dog would bite him). I am super careful about it not being overused or bringing out aggression in him. Ive seen plenty of dogs learn "smile"...i Just changed the word to be more "hostile sounding" to humans.

  • NASANASA
    Posts: 189
    Lmbo !! I don't have those problems , at least not to my face! But it sure sounds funny
  • RikkaRikka
    Posts: 1501

    I am working on a new trick with banjo where he "shows teeth"; the command is "fight". He has ZERO aggression issues towards any people, so its more for me to look like I have an attack dog than anything.



    Yes, It's funny (especially when I showed my friend who walks banjo every day and was there when I got him. Him and banjo are BFF's but when I showed him this trick he actually thought my dog would bite him).



    I guess our humor is different since I don't find that particularly funny.

    I can only think of that "trick" being used when you're in a serious fight-or-flight situation, not for when people call your dog "stupid"? Who does that?


    Kobe1468 said:

    I can say that I will be returning to this dog park. Kobe had a great time, as did I. We met some great people and some awesome dogs.



    I'm glad you guys had a great time! :)
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    Lauren, living with a 4 y/o Shiba named after a scientist. ☆
    Post edited by Rikka at 2014-03-03 12:22:29
  • curlytailscurlytails
    Posts: 2779
    Kobe1468 said:

    We survived our first visit to the dog park!



    Whew! Nice update.

    @poltergeist, perhaps this is an appropriate thread for your anecdote? What the stranger said isn't exactly "funny," but it certainly is one of those comments that make you realize how little some people really understand about dogs, and how they project their ignorance onto yours. Those are the encounters that make me double-take and step back a bit, because I find them curious, though not necessarily funny and sometimes aggravating and personally insulting.
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  • Poltergeist, I am working on a new trick with banjo where he "shows teeth"; the command is "fight". He has ZERO aggression issues towards any people, so its more for me to look like I have an attack dog than anything. I suggest trying it out so next time someone calls your dog stupid and you say fight and he looks angry, they'll be scared. Yes it's mean. Yes, It's funny (especially when I showed my friend who walks banjo every day and was there when I got him. Him and banjo are BFF's but when I showed him this trick he actually thought my dog would bite him). I am super careful about it not being overused or bringing out aggression in him. Ive seen plenty of dogs learn "smile"...i Just changed the word to be more "hostile sounding" to humans.



    Wow, that sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. Both with people, and especially with other dogs.
  • poltergeistpoltergeist
    Posts: 426
    @curlytails Yeah, it's not the first time I had people like that either. I've had one person unnecessarily stomp their foot behind my dog (I have no idea why) but it made my dog very nervous and scared. I'm glad my dog isn't a biting or aggressive dog because I think a lot of people are asking to be bitten!
    I have to really forget people like that and be unphased by it, but it makes it harder just to walk your own dog, etc.
    image
  • i know a lot of people who teach their dog to smile. I just use the word fight, not smile. He doesn't tighten up or anything. jeez. he is is sitting peacefully, but smiling.

    It's akin to using the word "attack" to teach sit.
    Post edited by BanjoTheBetaDog at 2014-03-03 20:47:56
  • Kira_KiraKira_Kira
    Posts: 2482
    I think that the concern is more so that the word that you have chosen for that particular behavior has a negative connotation in addition to the behavior that could be perceived by other people and dogs as aggressive.

    You may not see the word "fight" as negative, but the perception from a stranger hearing an owner give the command "fight" and his dog shows teeth... I can see where that could be cause for concern. You already experienced that perception from your friend, and he knows and is comfortable with your dog.
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  • AWE46M3AWE46M3
    Posts: 357
    People who bring treats and give them to their dog - in front of a bunch of other dogs - then get upset because they now have dogs following them and jumping up on them makes me scratch my head. You have treats at a dog park and you're surprised by having dogs all over you? Really?
  • Kira, its only because I told my friend (who is quite gullible) that in the three days he hasn't seen banjo, I taught him how to attack on command (I turned a sweet lovable puppy into an attack dog in three days? he really should have known better since he literally spends an hour a day with him). He kept going "seriously?" and I kept going "yeah look".

    To me there are "obedience tricks" which serve a purpose (heel, leave it, sit, stay, come etc) and "performance tricks" (paw, "bang" (play dead), roll over, smile). The performance tricks are to keep his mind sharp and "show off" for guests. I really find them quite useless except that learning is healthy for him so I have to teach him new things. Don't worry, its not as irresponsible as it sounds. I've never asked him to "perform" anywhere but at home.

  • NASANASA
    Posts: 189
    Prepare to be confused lol....

    I have to agree with @Banjothebetadog . At first I was like huh, but after the explanation it makes sense. Teaching a dog to smile, or show teeth doesn't mean the dog will become aggressive especially to the other dogs. In fact I have never seen a Shiba who has played and NOT shown their teeth. Of course it looks scary but we know the dogs intentions.

    You may not see the word "fight" as negative, but the perception from a stranger hearing an owner give the command "fight" and his dog shows teeth... I can see where that could be cause for concern.


    I agree with @Kira_kira on this. I think that was his whole purpose though. To give the Impression of a scary dog although he has a mild mannered dog.


    Worse Case Scenario
    I do think this is dangerous however because in VA and lots of places in the US, it can be perceived as a threat. He may smile at someone who carries a gun. They would have every right to shoot him if they did. You used an attack word 'Fight' and your dog "threatened them", they used self defense.

    In court trying to explain that your dog wasn't aggressive at all, and the judge asks you why you taught him to show teeth using the word fight, and you respond 'because people tease your dog'... yea good luck with that one.


    Back to basics
    @Banjothebetadog If someone teased you, is the first thing you do- take a fighting stance and say lets fight (Although you really dont intend to fight)? If not, then I would advise you not to teach your dog something you wouldn't do in the same situation.


    In the end: Your dog your choice. Im sure you are a responsible dog owner who is ready to deal with any and all consequences of your pup. :)
  • Yeah, its not a response to being teased. Someone teased him on a walk the other day, and I looked at this woman and said, "If my dog bit your face and attacked you for that, I wouldn't feel bad. You should be less of a cu** to strange animals". Her husband, not thrilled with my choice of words, was about to fight me. (He stood no chance, he was half my size and I am pretty capable of handling myself, even with one hand on the leash). My dog is more patient than I am. (she was running up behind him and growling. He would run a few feet up and turn around like "wtf?". After the third time, I chose the words I chose).

    Again, since I don't use "performance" tricks anywhere outside the home, I am not worried (same with paw. In dog world, the one paw up can be an invite to play. I don't want another dog to see that and think my dog is inviting him and sprint over so we just don't perform anywhere but home).

    I see what you are saying about it being taken the wrong way, but I wouldn't put him in that position.





  • sunyatasunyata
    Posts: 8584

    Yeah, its not a response to being teased. Someone teased him on a walk the other day, and I looked at this woman and said, "If my dog bit your face and attacked you for that, I wouldn't feel bad. You should be less of a cu** to strange animals". Her husband, not thrilled with my choice of words, was about to fight me. (He stood no chance, he was half my size and I am pretty capable of handling myself, even with one hand on the leash). My dog is more patient than I am. (she was running up behind him and growling. He would run a few feet up and turn around like "wtf?". After the third time, I chose the words I chose).



    Because this response to being teased is better? This forum is about education, so I feel that this is appropriate: A much better response to that would be to stop, politely ask the woman why she is growling at your dog, and ask her to stop. She may be unaware that her behaviour is offensive or may even be disabled. If the behaviour persisted, then walk away and remove yourself and your dog from the situation.

    You being a jackass about it is not helping the situation, nor is it providing a safe environment for your dog. What would have happened if that guy HAD hit you? Or even worse, hit your dog? And do not say that "he stood no chance" because you obviously are not the most astute person in the world, so it is very possible that you are underestimating his defense abilities.

    So lesson learned: If someone is bothering you or your dog, either address the situation in a civil manner or remove yourself and your dog from the situation all together.
    Bella 2Mountains 2Nola 2
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  • Oh Sunyata, how I love your condescension. You may not think I am astute, but given I spent my whole life wrestling (20+ years ), boxing 4x a week for the past 5 years and enough street fights to last a lifetime (plus MMA instruction 3 days a week), I know how to size someone up and REALLY know when I am in the company of someone who is tough vs isn't tough. SO tell me how I am so obviously not astute as to be able to know my odds in a fight before it starts? Oh, that's right, you are from the "one size fits all" mentality of life.

    Since you are happy to call me a jackass, let me fill you in.... 1) every time she did it, I turned around, gave her a dirty look and proceeded to tell banjo not to worry and ignore it. 2) it was a straight path with no means of egress left or right. Couldn't escape the situation without turning around and directly confronting them. Which when I did, she said "what's your problem"... to which I responded how I did.

    Yes, it is better, I am pretty tired of people thinking that being nice all the time is the way to solve problems. It doesn't and unfortunately there was no other way around it. If I turned and walked the other way we would have been face to face... a MUCH more dangerous situation.

    When that guy wanted to fight me we were about ten feet apart and he couldn't come closer to hit me or the dog.

    I don't know where you get off talking down to me every chance you get, but get over yourself. You have spent exactly ZERO time in anyone elses shoes. I am simply going to not use this forum anymore because if I want to be talked down to by a complete stranger, I'll start posting political rants on facebook.

    Good luck with your dog.


  • Just to go back to the original topic for a moment:
    - The guy who brings his bitch in heat without the doggy diaper required as posted and allows random males to hump her
    - The person who asks you and your friend awkward questions (i.e. are you guys lesbians? (my friend is a guy))
    _ The person who yells at you because their dog wants to sit at your feet because you gave them the "down" command when they jumped up on you (Not sure why I got yelled at, but I am not a fan of being jumped on by strange dogs)
    - The person who offers treats to your dog when they themselves do not have a dog

    These have all happened to me and my friend when we take his Husky to the dog park to get some of her uncontrolled energy out.
  • NASANASA
    Posts: 189
    :-t I may get back lash for this but @sunyata - this entire thread in my opinion about "Dog park people" is a little negative. You cant single this guy out for the way he chose to handle his situation. Even your advice to him could be deem wrong. Just like we preach negative or positive reactions, to something bad our dogs do is incorrect, so is any reaction to a person who is doing something wrong. He really should WALK AWAY, no words spoken at all.

    He sounds like me, I cant say something without it being sarcastic or snide. So I have learned to SAY NOTHING and walk away or avoid. He chose to engage and put the guy in his place. Maybe it is the best thing or maybe it isn't.
    but this entire thread is primarily dedicated to bashing "dog park people", of which I am one of those dog park people, I just laugh at it and take no offense.

    To other it could be a little offensive, maybe we should criticize the creator of the thread. I'm sure we would have if it was called, "Gay dog lovers -_- " .

    Or we just let @Banjothebetadog share his experience without being ripped apart, and Ignore his comments without calling him names.

    PS- I mean to attack or offend no one.

    Now back to talking about the people who visit the dog park! =))
  • NASANASA
    Posts: 189
    - The person who offers treats to your dog when they themselves do not have a dog


    Careful with these, i think it was talked about somewhere but there are people who purposely feed bad things to dogs to make them sick.
  • Kira_KiraKira_Kira
    Posts: 2482
    Two things:

    1. I actually got the nerve to bring Kira to the dog park. It was Sunday morning, quiet, and we were the only ones there for the first 5 minutes. When others came, all the dogs were wonderfully well-behaved and looked after by responsible owners. We spoke to all the owners and they were all very attentive and well-engaged with their dogs. No one brought treats, ignored their dogs, any of those behaviors previously mentioned. I think we just got lucky! :)

    There were quite a few puppies, which Kira DID NOT care for. She was not aggressive, but she showed her teeth and growled, letting them know that she did not want them to push her. They were very good and gave her space. Kira seems to get annoyed with the pups, but loved all the other older, mature dogs. No problems at all!

    I don't think it will be a ritual or habit-forming trip, we just happened to be in the neighborhood of a dog park that had a big dog and small dog side. There was quite a bit of commotion and near-fights on the other side. Keeping them separate is definitely a bonus! I think I will stick to doggie daycare simply because she is with other dogs that are regularly there. I know there are new additions sometimes, but the staff are very attentive and I call and check in on her.

    2. Never assume that you can "handle" a situation. My boyfriend has quite a few firearms and uses them safely, but there are so many people out there that have concealed carry permits and you never know if you might piss off the wrong person.
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  • NASANASA
    Posts: 189
    Lol @ kira number 2 ... Especially in Florida
  • Hey everyone! Just took Haku to the dog park for the first time this weekend and he had a ball! Met lots of nice dogs and their owners, who were very attentive. Haku, a creamie, came back exhausted and brown from rolling around with a golden retriever who had been swimming in the pond right before playing with Haku.

    My boyfriend, however, took him yesterday and while Haku had no issues, he told me about this lady who went with her young dog and proceeded to berate everyone on their dogs' faults and shortcomings, saying things like "You can tell that dog is aggressive- he must be part pitbull."

    She even went so far as to grab another person's dog by the collar and push its face into the ground when it nipped at the air around her dog, saying no dog would be aggressive with hers! She also never took her dog's leash off.

    Just hearing about it made me furious, and I think I would have lost my cool if she'd messed with my Haku.
  • @NASA, my friend's dog is on a very controlled diet to limit her begging for snacks from outside people, so we kindly declined and said no. I have seen many articles of people preparing meat balls and hiding them around normal dog walk areas so dogs could find them and be poisoned.
    Post edited by Candywolf357 at 2014-03-05 16:26:06
  • BootzBootz
    Posts: 3495
    @BanjoTheBetaDog @NASA not sure how this got ugly. But I can see it from both sides. I'm more like @sunyata and think we should be calm in the way we handle things as things can quickly turn ugly. But at the same time my husband is like @BanjoTheBetaDog in the way that, he would quickly take offensive to people and would take necessary measures if needed.

    Anyways, as @Candywolf357 mentioned, i'm actually from the bay area, so this affects me. This is the #1 reason why I always stress how important it is for owners to teach their dog the leave it command and also to just ignore stuff on the road.

    The culprit is clever and have been leaving the meatballs in bushes as well. Which of course owners can't see, and can't enforce the "leave it" command. Hence why I stress the teaching your dog to ignore food on the road.
  • curlytailscurlytails
    Posts: 2779
    NASA said:

    but this entire thread is primarily dedicated to bashing "dog park people", of which I am one of those dog park people, I just laugh at it and take no offense.

    To other it could be a little offensive, maybe we should criticize the creator of the thread. I'm sure we would have if it was called, "Gay dog lovers -_- " .



    But he didn't, because he chose his words with more tact. Actually, knowing @tatonka and his participation history, I'm pretty confident that this was not the intention of this thread. (That's one of the advantages of establishing a post history, after all.) And if you'll notice, there are plenty of us who are trying to provide a more positive perspective while sticking to the topic at hand.

    Just for the record, I honestly don't think "bashing" is in the spirit of this forum. However, I think most of us take pains to distinguish 'bashing' from criticism, feedback, and even the occasional humorous or sarcastic barb. Regardless of intentions, if you choose to post about potentially offensive behavior or communicate misleading information, it is not unreasonable to expect a response.

    That said, this perfectly fine thread nearly got derailed. I join the rest of you in trying to steer things back on track.
    image
    Bowdu 寶肚 (Shiba) and Bowpi 寶媲 (Basenji) with M.C.
  • knnwangknnwang
    Posts: 645
    I’m going to chime in on this thread. I live in a large gated apartment complex 600+ units, and there is a dog park within our complex. The property management has no size restriction for dogs so everyone and their grandmother have a dog, or some sort of pet.

    I am one of the regulars that use the dog park, and yeah I ran into some (not all) stupid people. Meet many great neighbors, and make some great friends too. We have a large gathering in the afternoon just before sunset at the dog park every afternoon. Great for me since the other dogs tire out my Shiba a lot easier than me just walking him.

    Granted it’s not a public dog park, and I’m assuming most of the people that use it live in the complex, but I suspect some of our outside neighbors sneak in to use one of the 4 spas/pools, or the outdoor exercise stations we have all over the place, and plenty of free doggy poo bags stations everywhere.
    Will any who, my rants of dog park people. Keep in mind this is not the norm. All if not most of the time Ratchet and I have a pleasant time going out or to the dog park. I am also ex-ARMY 11B from age 17 to 22, so not much scares me.

    A jackass that had an aggressive Doberman pincher off lease that bit another person before, then me. I am sure that dog was put down. In my area you gets one warning, first bite, you have to quarantine your dog for 10 days, second offence the dog is taken to a “shelter.” That person was evicted out of our complex shortly after the incident.

    -A new tenant, some women that have no control of two large dogs was dragged over by a lab and a bulldog, as she was screaming, “I don’t have control of these guys.” She still came in with her two dogs even when all the dogs where barking at each other through the fence. They, the two big dogs began to bully and pack on the small dogs. She then made a comment “Your dogs are small why don’t you just pick them up”. Oh, that got me pissed. I kicked her labs when I saw some fur fly when it engaged with Ratchet (although it was January, and may have been because Ratchet was getting ready to blowing his under coat.) I then picked up Ratchet walked out of the dog park, cursed the lady out, pulled out my pocket knife, and said if they get in a fight again I’m going to stab it you F*in Bitch. I found out later the other regulars that was there (especial this one old retired ex Air Force Captain) also cursed her out, and kicked them out for having aggressive dogs or something. I see them on walks, but they stay/walk the other why when they see us, and I have yet to see them in the dog park again. Lol

    -I do not just barge into the dog park when I see new people or dogs in there. I always walk up and ask if they are friendly. I have run into three different dog owners that said their dog gets along great with people just not other dogs. I will just say okay, thanks for the warning, and we go off on a walk around the complex since it is so big, and the landscapers keep the place looking like a park, it’s nice. It’s funny the retired Air Force Captain will curse them out, and kick them out by tell them you can’t have an aggressive dog off lease and they need to leave. He is a big, tall, old, cursing, black man, so I am sure the white girls run off simply out of fear, maybe. He does have a point, it is unfair for someone to bogard the dog park for himself or herself.

    -I ran into an old, bitter, negative devoiced woman that use to show up at the dog park with her, but is there to socialize, and bitch about how bad their day is or complain her ex-husband. Too much information sometimes, hahaha. Not there to socialize there dog, just there to hang out. She has moved since then.

    -The dog park is close to the children playground too so every now and then we will get a kid or two come in or stand along the fence line to pet the dogs. I am fine with the kids and Ratchet loves the attention, I just warn them not to feed them anything. One time these two little boys started showing up in the afternoon when we would gather for about 3 days straight. We did not have any problems with them. They were being respectful to the dogs and us. Then on the third day a car rolled up stopped, rolled down the windows and it was the boys’ mother. They were yelled at, I see them ride they bikes and say hello but have not come into the dog park since. Mom must not be a dog person.

    -People who bring in there puppy before they are vaccinated. Once, a teenager walked in with a little pup, and said his puppy was only 4 weeks old? I have yet to see any of them return and I only saw them twice in that one week. I am getting better at recognizing a small dog from a puppy, and one of the other regulars is very good and explaining vaccination since our environment has a large dog population.

    -People that had puppies during the Christmas session or was a gift, and then the dog just suddenly disappears. Usually within 6 months in.

    @BanjoTheBetaDog relax bro. If you post anything on a forum you will get feedback on any comment you make regardless if it’s a negative or good. I’m sure you had an ex try to control and tell you what to do. If you feel your being talked down to, so what, like anything else you can either accept or ignore their input. It’s not as if you’re married to Sunyata.
  • Kobe1468Kobe1468
    Posts: 1588
    Great post @curlytails

    "Until one has loved an animal, a part of one's soul remains unawakened."
  • My original point with Banjo was simply that teaching your dog to do something that looks like aggression is a bad idea on a number of levels. One, if other dogs see it, they may interpret that as aggression, and react accordingly. Two, basically the same thing if people see it, and teaching your dog to do something that looks like aggression to people can get you and, worse, your dog into trouble, and have your dog labeled aggressive. Also, let me be clear here: you have a Shiba. While some may make it up to 40 pounds, many are in the 20 pound range. There is nothing worse than a small(ish) dog that looks aggressive, and it can get your dog hurt. It would be equally stupid to do with a big dog, like an Akita, but with a Shiba? Really?
    It's the equivilent of being the little guy who harasses the big guy for no apparent reason--just not smart, and not particularly funny either. I guess people would see it is more problematic if I taught my 120 akita to appear to be snarling on command and said "get 'em" or something, but it is equally problematic with a small dog. Do you want your dog to be labeled "aggressive"? (Especially when your dog is not?) Do you even know what that can mean legally and to your dog? (And yes, I read later that it is only an "at home" trick, but still).

    As to astuteness, well, I guess I'm not seeing that at all. your boxing/wrestling/mma record has nothing to do with this situation at all. Yes, the woman growling at your dog was inappropriate, but your response was equally, if not more, inappropriate, and certainly does show a lack of judgement. As was said, the appropriate thing to do is ask the person to stop, and if they do not, take your dog out of the situation. It's not a matter of "being nice" or not, it's having the judgement and maturity to back down from a situation when appropriate.

    And NASA, "ignoring" misinformation or bad ideas is not a good idea on a forum like this. This thread will still be here whether Banjo is here or not, and it's not a good idea to just let this stuff stand. Nor is it anything like homophobia, and I don't really know how you came to that comparison.

    Overall, though, a lot of people experiences here point to why many people do not recommend dog parks. You can't control the type of people who come there, and many of them have no idea how to deal with dogs (or people!)
  • Seriously Knwang? You think that's ok? Threatening to stab someone?


    Well, guess another case in the point of why dog parks are a bad idea. I can handle the dogs but if this is how people thing they are supposed to handle conflict/disagreement, then I want to be far away.
  • knnwangknnwang
    Posts: 645
    Shibamistress, I am raised in an old school traditional Chinese family, and I am an ex-ARMY infantryman (11B). So for the longest time, even though I knew I was that way, it did not click in my head until I hit my late twenties “How the F* did I become/get myself into this, and think it’s OK.” No, violence against anyone is wrong, but I will hold my own if pulled into a fight.

    I did not threaten to stab someone, I threatened to stab the 80+ pound Lab after observing her and her dogs. If I saw Ratchet bleed I defiantly would of attacked her dog. If you were there, and saw how the lab was ruffing up the other dogs, and making them yelp then the dog being bullied running back to their prospective owner, then here her say “Your dogs are small why don’t you just pick them up.” Will, I guess it is just me.

    -another one: people that do not pick up their dogs poop. It’s now routine for us (me and the other regulars) to get the scooper, and walk the park, and pick up what we can see, as the first thing to do when going to the dog park.
  • sunyatasunyata
    Posts: 8584
    @knnwang - Threatening to stab the dog, IMO, is way worse. It is not the dog's fault, it is the owner's fault. Not that threatening to stab the owner is any better; either could land you in jail if the wrong person overheard you or if the person/owner you threatened pressed charges.

    I think the whole point of this thread is that taking your dog to an off leash park is a gamble. In some instances it pays off with a rewarding and positive experience for both you and your dog. In others, it can be a traumatic experience for all parties involved.

    The key is to know dog behaviour and to be able to handle yourself in a respectable manner when things do not go as planned.

    Either way, it is nice to have a place on the forum to go and vent when stupid people do stupid things with their dogs at dog parks.
    Bella 2Mountains 2Nola 2
    Casey, with Bella and Nola, hanging out in the mountains of Virginia.
    I Wander, I Ride
  • Kit_Keet_Kit_Keet_
    Posts: 206
    I was at the dog park a while ago (before it turned into a ridiculously cold winter...) with Bela. Bela likes other dogs, but she LOVES people, so she tends to say hi to absolutely every single person she runs into in the dog park.

    Well, a younger guy was there with his fairly young dog; the puppy couldn't have been over 8-9 months old. Bela walks up to the man to say hi, and he pets her. Next thing you know, his puppy walks over to him and pees on his leg. Yes, I giggled, who wouldn't!

    Well obviously he was not happy about having been peed on, so he proceeds to alpha roll his dog. Not giggling anymore! Ugh.
  • This thread needs a bump since the original topic was quite humorous, also our trip to the dog park with my friends husky warranted more funnies. Also! I saw such a tiny shiba yesterday they said he was 13lb at 1yo he was a cutie, but was obsessively marking EVERYTHING, this is why I'm a firm believer in spay/neuter, the obsessive markers drive me nuts. Anywho:
    - the person who thinks they are a professional photographer and takes pic of EVERYONE'S dog(s) and when you ask to see the pic they say you can buy them off her site.
    - the person who has the two antisocial dogs on the otherwise of the fence who is obviously there for a breed specific meet up (white shepherds) and anytime a dog goes near the dense the dogs attack at the fence, they proceed to bein in their obviously aggressive dogs, who snap at everyone's dogs that come near them for a hello.
    - the person with the husky that wants to swim in the water dish (us)
    -the kid (teenager) squeamish of his own dogs poop
    - the person who carries Their dog around the park and doesn't let them play wig the other dogs (it was a full grown yappy toy breed)
    This was our day at the doggy park yesterday, hope everyone is enjoying St. Patrick's Day!
  • Sadly, the park is no longer empty so i've learned the need to navigate these people.

    There are two in particular (a mother daughter) who I cannot seem to explain things to.

    They have 2 chows. One is a gentle giant and usually runs for 10 minutes then hangs out. Its not exactly dangerous and I kind of like him even if he does get fur everywhere.

    The other is a nutcase who nips at EVERYTHING and other dogs make it clear to get away. Yet this woman brings BOTH dogs and the crazy chow is ALWAYS causing an issue.

    Her daughter (12 or 13) is committed to throwing toys out there no matter how many times (and how nicely) I try to ask her not to. It results in chase turned barking, etc.

    I don't know if there was a question here, but it felt good to complain.



  • sunyatasunyata
    Posts: 8584
    @BanjoTheBetaDog - I have two suggestions for you for that situation (which sucks, by the way, especially if Banjo really likes the park). The first is to talk to the organizers of the park (county/city parks department if it is public, or the board if it is private) about putting up a rules sign the states no toys. Explain to them the issues that happen and that dog parks really should be about dogs socializing with other dogs, not dogs playing with their owners.

    The other suggestion is to learn this woman's routine and avoid the park when she is there. I know that is frustrating, but it sounds like the one dog is a liability waiting to happen. Maybe this woman will get bored of the park pretty quickly and move on to something else.

    Another suggestion, which it seems like you have tried to no avail, is to try and educate this woman regarding her dog's behaviour. If you are a patient person, you might keep at it. If not, the other two suggestions may provide some relief from "dog park people". :) (Seriously, I think people should have to pass a test in order to have dogs or kids!)
    Bella 2Mountains 2Nola 2
    Casey, with Bella and Nola, hanging out in the mountains of Virginia.
    I Wander, I Ride
  • Yeah, I've asked the girl nicely not to introduce a toy and her response is "but look how much fun they are having".... I want to explain its not fun but the pre-cursor to a fight. SHe is insistent on doing what she wants and even her mom has no control (reason number 8976787 I am happy i don't have a teenager.). Sadly we are on the same schedule (after work). There is another dog park which is ALWAYS empty but is made of a weird dirt compound. The one we go to is astroturf so it is cleaner.

  • And Chows. Yeah, another breed that in general is not dog park material. Sounds like one is ok, and one is, well, a Chow!
  • Any tips on explaining to people that they have no place in a dog park?

    We went on Sunday and when we got there it was just Banjo and me. I took out a ball and we played. A few minutes later, a couple came in with a friendly mutt and their kid. I put the ball away, and as soon as they entered the gates, I noticed the kid and told the parents my guy is friendly but jumps on kids, and before the parents could speak the kid (all of 6) says "It's ok, I am a dog person". Sure enough he was. Him and Banjo got along great and the other dog was totally not protective of the kid around Banjo. The kid really did his homework as as soon as banjo jumped on him, he said no, turned away and 10 seconds later turned back. After 3-4 of this, banjo got the message. That kid will be a good pet owner for sure.

    A few minutes later more dogs came in and it was chaotic but manageable as the dogs sorted themselves out. At this point there were a total of 5 dogs in the park, and the kid was even pointing out which dogs looked happy and which wanted to leave.

    Now for the part that I am still thinking about... this woman all jolly comes in with two dogs. A retriever of some type and a small little what looked like a mini-pitbull. As soon as she walks in, she throws a ball and all of the dogs go chasing after it. Growling ensues. Banjo (as he is prone to do) wins the toy and i get it from him. I then have 5 dogs jumping and nipping at my hands while I go give it back to the woman. I calmly said "you shouldn't throw a ball in a park, all of the dogs will fight over it" She laughs and says "oh, its ok" and THROWS IT AGAIN. Banjo goes to try to greet her mini-pit and the dog was frozen stiff and growling and tried to snip at banjo and the other dogs. They formed a circle around it, and it looked terrified and ready to attack.

    I called Banjo to me and this woman was completely oblivious. Not even paying attention to the chaos she is causing. We then left. Immediately.

    How in god's name do you address this with a person who has no idea what they are doing?

    @Sunyata, I took your advice and no longer go to that park around teh time of the chows. If we drive past and they are there, I keep driving and get Banjo's... "Wtf face"

    Post edited by BanjoTheBetaDog at 2014-06-10 13:08:04
  • zandramezandrame
    Posts: 1106
    @BanjoTheBetaDog, I think you did the best you can do. You proactively informed other owners of Banjo's habits and confronted the ball-thrower peacefully. I suppose you could confiscate the ball, but that might also lead to conflict with the woman. Without escalating, which I'm sure the dogs would sense, leaving the park was the best option.

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